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D0REMI
21-01-2010, 03:45 PM
Hello Guys,

I found a new wellness joint called Oriental Welllness just opposite my work place. Was there yesterday evening with my working buddy to check out the place and the standard of the ladies. Found it to be a very nicely renovated and extremely cozy wellness place. Was very impressed by the decor of the place. There were only 3 ladies there during the time I went. All 3 of the are very pleasant looking milfs, I guess their ages should be between late twenties to very early 30s. It is definitely not a place for guys looking for pretty SYT. Took a 1hr package that includes a free bodyscrub. I picked a lady called Yenny, to me she is the prettiest of the 3 while my colleague chose Sally. This is also definitely not a place for guys looking for exciting sex and wild hanky panky, as we found out the only hj is provided. I tried my utmost best to convince Yenny into a FJ, even to the extent of tempting her with more and more cash but was flatly rejected. My colleague also got the same response from his lady. So I guess it is just a good relax joint with at most a HJ special. But overall, we found that this is definitely a wonderful wellness place for us who want to have a good massage, rest and relax with a little HJ to destress. So it is just suited for guys who loves to have a good massage by pleasant looking MILFs.


Statistics of Yenny:
Looks: 7.5/10
Boobs: nice smooth and firm c-cup
Massage: 7.5/10
Hj: 8/10 partial autoroam with light kisses on lips
Attitude: 9/10 extremely friendly and good service

Statistics of Sally (according to my colleague)
Looks: 7/10
Boobs: nice smooth c+ cup
Massage: 8.5/10
Hj: 8.5/10 partial autoroam
Attitude: 8.5/10

sookahchua
21-01-2010, 09:26 PM
where is it bro

fooklaikeong
22-01-2010, 12:07 AM
doremi, i think i know which joint you r talking about. it is opposite the concourse right? went there on tue, the girl msg for me called Sally. she is abt 33 year old, and her msg was dam good. but too bad, she dosen't hj me leh. u very lucky man, i think she like you thats why she HJ you, but her msg was really good. she really came from proper trained msg. i was curious how many girl around, she reply me and said if total hv 3. saw 1 very tall pretty and quite young girl at counter but nvr ask the name. Sally told me 1 new girl coming to work on nxt day and ask me to come again. i just reply her softly......cannot la, not so fast no money. hehehe.....Well if it is the same place as what bro doremi mention, this place is new open and beautiful renovated and good msg, attitude and service of the girl excellent. no other special service except hj. damage is $40 for 1hr msg

D0REMI
22-01-2010, 09:30 AM
doremi, i think i know which joint you r talking about. it is opposite the concourse right?

Hello Fooklaikeong, if it is beside a chinese mala steamboat T-one then it should be the 1. Nice place right?

D0REMI
23-01-2010, 01:56 PM
Hi bros,
was quite busy with projects thus late in replying those few PMs. finally found time to do the replies. Hope the 4 of you dudes like my findings.

Happy weekend dudes!

kikomilla
26-01-2010, 12:35 AM
Visited today.Called to book Yenny at 8pm.
The place was nice and new, one of the nicest massage place that I have visited. The dim lightings make it even more cozy. The recept led me to the room, waited a while for Yenny before she finally came into the room. Yenny told me she is from HongKong. Wow! First time get HK girl doing massage for me.The massage is really very good with strength and pressure, very professional. Can say she is one of the best that ever massage me. She told me she was trained by a Sifu from shanghai. The shanghai master also taught her the true art of ZhuaGen. She asked me to try it. Her ZhuaGen technique seems to be very professional. It lasted for about 15mins and then she ask me whether I want to release. I said yes. She then applied more oil onto my already standing dicky. She sensationally massage the area around my brother. I move my hands below her T-shirt and fondle her boobs.
She then lift up her t-shirt and bra. I slowly suck her boobs while she massge my brother. After not so long, I exploded. She went to take a warm towel to clean me up. The feeling was great. After that she gave me a cup of hot tea. Great service!


looks: 8/10
body: 7.5/10
boobs: b-cup
massage: 9.5/10 (good strength and well trained)
ZhuGen: 9/10
Damage: $40 (massage) + $50(ZhuaGen+Hj)
RTF: yes

kikomilla
26-01-2010, 12:40 AM
Went to row of shop houses opposite CC and found a D' Oriental.

Went in ask for Sally and Yenny but no such person....


Hi Bro Stone, maybe you go to wrong shop. I went today booked Yenny. Yenny is a HongKong girl, pretty and very good professional massage. She can do good ZhuaGen. Quite rare to find HK girl around.

Tomatos
26-01-2010, 09:42 AM
bro ts kindly pm ctc. wd like to try yenny. thanks.

leoleo
26-01-2010, 10:21 AM
Hi bros,
was quite busy with projects thus late in replying those few PMs. finally found time to do the replies. Hope the 4 of you dudes like my findings.

Happy weekend dudes!
Hi bro, could you kindly pm ctc? I would really like to try this place. Thank you!

Stocks
26-01-2010, 11:06 AM
Pm contact pls ... zhuagen my fav

yme1810
26-01-2010, 11:08 AM
Bro Doremi,
can share the location or phone no. of the place? thanks in advance!

skkan
26-01-2010, 11:46 AM
Bros, please pm me the location, thanks, I'm nene lover:D

CockStanding
26-01-2010, 02:37 PM
sounds like good place for a soothing good rub. ts pls pm me location thanks

Shadow17
26-01-2010, 02:50 PM
Hi bro, kindly pm me the contacts pls....... Many thanks in advance!

oliver191919
26-01-2010, 03:00 PM
Name: Yenny
Looks: 7.5/10
Massage: 8.5/10
Juagen: 8.5/10

Ambience is fantastic. New joint that is has a beautiful decor. The free mosha is quite sensual n enjoyable. They have a promotion whereby the 6th visit will be free.


Damage: $35(45mins) + 50

RTM: Will be back. Would be great if the tall pretty recept can massage me :)

D0REMI
26-01-2010, 03:14 PM
sounds like good place for a soothing good rub. ts pls pm me location thanks

Hello CockStanding,

it is indeed a very nice place to have a good massage after a hard days work. I personally think that Yenny did a very good massage on me and help me feel so much more relaxed after the session. Would like to stress that this is my personal opinion of the place. I have just pm you and a few other bros the location. Hope you guys like it as much as me. In the mean while, hope to uncover more good lobangs to share with you guys.

Good day dudes!

ALLDayLong
26-01-2010, 03:35 PM
Hi bro DoReMi can pm the address of this place? Looks like a great place to have a good msg. Many thanks.

roger1970
26-01-2010, 06:33 PM
Hi Bro,

Can you share your ctcs pls.
glad to provide FR after I try. Cheerios!

cc66
26-01-2010, 09:07 PM
Went to tried this place last sat. Short belated FR.
New place so business is really slow and only 3 rooms.

Name: Xiao Yu ( i think )
Looks: ~6.5
Massage: 7.5 (good hard massage),
Plus point is she cover legs with towel when massage body
and vice versa and then use hot towel to cover body when done.
HJ: 7.5 (really concentrate on massage your groin area as well)
Auto-roam: Limited, but she has firm breast
RTF: Maybe.

If you are going for ambience/coziness, there are better options around that area along NBR.

chump
26-01-2010, 09:18 PM
same here....
any kind souls able to advise where this place is and a contact?
in need of a good massage..

thanks in advance

popee16
26-01-2010, 09:21 PM
Bro,
Can share with me the location?

ahboynicky
26-01-2010, 11:54 PM
hi all,

Thks Bro TS for sharing contact.

Went down to the joint after getting the contact. At the counter sat a pretty and innocent looking prc recept, she recommended Helen to massage me.

Waited about 5 min in the room and in came Helen. she started with back massage, she have the strength and skill to massage. she know where is the correct point at the back to massage. she professional in massage. After the back and leg massage for about 40min, she ask me to turn over and massage my head and my big tummy. the whole massage make me feel relax and cure my backache. very good.

Then she ask whether need to massage my brother, and i said please help youself. And she very gentle hand towards my little bro. can touch her boobs abt b cup. after for abt 5 min and released. she take hot towel to clean me up and pour me a hot tea. good attitude to me.

I guess she is abt early 30, and 6.5/10 for her look, 8.5/10 for massage and 7.5/10 for HJ.

damage is $40 + $50.

recept told me if come 6 time will be free. overall a good outing for me.

Hardyboy
27-01-2010, 08:20 AM
Wonder why all the FRs are by newbies.

evereadyme
27-01-2010, 08:46 AM
hi bro doremi can pm me the add of this place? promise a fr many thanks.

evereadyme
27-01-2010, 09:11 AM
had my session with yenny. told me she 30 yrs old but she looks much older to me, more like 35 yrs old. the massage was great as mentioned by other bro's fr on her. finished the session with a juagen. saw 2 other ladies when i walk past the ladies rm beside toilet. one of them looks totally cmi, wonder what is her name. the other is ok looking has a sweet innocent look. both looks to be about same age group as yenny.

name: yenny
looks: 7.5/10 nice looking milf
age: should be about 35 yrs old
boobs: 7/10 b cup
massage: 8.5/10 good
juagen: 8.5/10 unique
damage: $40entrance + $50hj + $10tip
rtm: mayb

scorpion sting
27-01-2010, 01:44 PM
hi bro...can pm the contact and venue to me..wish to try...thanks

newcomer
28-01-2010, 03:51 AM
will anyone care to share her contact & location? Thanks a million!

microernest
28-01-2010, 08:34 AM
Hi TS, can I have the location? Thanks!

j12345_sg
28-01-2010, 01:59 PM
Hi, me too. Appreciate any bro can share with of the location or contact please..

Martin65
29-01-2010, 10:00 AM
Thank you Doremi!
Massage was superb!
Have a great weekend!:)

D0REMI
29-01-2010, 10:05 AM
Hello bro Martin65, great to hear that you had a wonderful session. Which lady did the massage for you? Care to share a more detailed FR?

Martin65
29-01-2010, 10:07 AM
The one you intro Yenny!
Good recommendation!

D0REMI
29-01-2010, 10:17 AM
Hi Martin, I was very surprised by her standard of massage. She is indeed a very rare find. I love going to massages and have visited many shops around the island, both clean and hanky panky... To me, Yenny's massage can be rated as one of the top few.

sgfemales
29-01-2010, 02:27 PM
can pm me the contact?

wooloomooloo
30-01-2010, 12:00 AM
tks ts doremi for sharing location. went down to look for yenny. place looks new and nice ambience so made me feel very comfortable... yenny's massage was very good and professional. managed to cure my stiff and acheing shoulders and neck muscles. her massage skills is way above many in this trade. said she has about 12 years of experience so i guess she must be in her mid thirty age...after good long massage, she ask me to try her juagen skills. her juagen is good. said she learn the skill from a foreign master. after the juagen, she perform a hj for me. the hj was normal and she only allowed me to roam her boobs. overall session was good especially the massage and the juagen...

lah-oth
30-01-2010, 12:06 AM
Contact pls

lah-oth
30-01-2010, 12:07 AM
Pm contact pls

rickroll123
30-01-2010, 12:30 AM
Please click one of the Quick Reply icons in the posts above to activate Quick Reply.

rickroll123
30-01-2010, 12:45 AM
hey bro , kindly pm me the address and contacts pls?

jimmy79
30-01-2010, 01:28 AM
Can any kind soul PM me the location? Today I find until my underwear wet, still cannot find it. Sianz...

Stan Goh
30-01-2010, 09:42 AM
can have the contact. thanks bro.

rajjnu
30-01-2010, 11:33 AM
Bro, mind if you PM me the location?
Thanks.
:)

D0REMI
02-02-2010, 12:07 PM
Hello Bros,

I was there again yesterday evening after work to look for Yenny. However to my utmost disappointment, Yenny is on medical leave and will only be back today. I was introduced another lady by the name of Helen.


Statistics of Helen:
Looks: 6.5/10 (A bit flashy)
Age: 33 years old
Boobs: b-cup
Massage: 8.5/10 (Quite good)
Hj: 8/10 (Full autoroam)
Attitude: 8.5/10 Friendly and extremely obliging
Rtm: Will return for Yenny.

fisher7900
02-02-2010, 05:02 PM
I think this place and the one at Joo Chiat Rd should be the same management. Visit 5 time the 6 time is free.. The service and price are the same, $40/hr + $50 for HJ (only)

Can PM the address to me... will like to try Yenny out.

JaiRai
02-02-2010, 06:20 PM
Tried tis place a couple of days ago. Cant remember wat was the lady name. Overall not bad. Its next to steamboat restaurant, "Ti*n X*a D* Y* ***", 2nd flr. MILF joint. Damage 50 HJ + entrance 40.

bluewebuser
02-02-2010, 07:38 PM
will like to try, can have the contact? thanks

oliver191919
03-02-2010, 10:02 AM
I think this place and the one at Joo Chiat Rd should be the same management. Visit 5 time the 6 time is free.. The service and price are the same, $40/hr + $50 for HJ (only)

Can PM the address to me... will like to try Yenny out.


There r quite a number of joints especially those around the Jalan Sultan area offering the same go 5 sessions get 1 session free promotion. As such, the promotion is no big deal, its just a common marketing ploy. Whats most important is the quality of the place, the girls, the massage and the specials. I have only been to this joint once to try Yenny. On the whole, the session was quite good, the massage was superb....
But I wld like to point out certain areas of this joint that can be improved upon: The joint seem to have very few gals so not much choices for us customers. Us customers always like variety. Also, the gals only provide HJ and their dressing is far too conservative. Generally men prefer sexily dressed gals then a plain jane dressed in conservatively wear. Hope the boss of this joint will take note....:)

fisher7900
03-02-2010, 04:05 PM
There r quite a number of joints especially those around the Jalan Sultan area offering the same go 5 sessions get 1 session free promotion. As such, the promotion is no big deal, its just a common marketing ploy. Whats most important is the quality of the place, the girls, the massage and the specials. I have only been to this joint once to try Yenny. On the whole, the session was quite good, the massage was superb....
But I wld like to point out certain areas of this joint that can be improved upon: The joint seem to have very few gals so not much choices for us customers. Us customers always like variety. Also, the gals only provide HJ and their dressing is far too conservative. Generally men prefer sexily dressed gals then a plain jane dressed in conservatively wear. Hope the boss of this joint will take note....:)


Bro do you mind PM the address to me... but maybe the big boss behind are the same, just that they have few different joint in different area

fooklaikeong
04-02-2010, 12:41 AM
return to look for sally but was told she left liao. requested for yenny but was busy. there was another lady jiajia was available but looks CMI so decided to come back another day.

fooklaikeong
04-02-2010, 12:47 AM
return to look for sally but was told she left liao. requested for yenny but was busy. there was another lady jiajia was available but looks CMI so decided to come back another day.

D0REMI
05-02-2010, 12:19 AM
Hello Guys,

I sacrificed my lunch hour to have another session with Hongkong lady Yenny. Just like my previous visit, the massage was excellent. It would have been perfect if I had succeeded in convincing her into a FJ but unfortunately just like the previous time, my attempts failed. No matter how hard I tried, I got rejected. No choice but to settle for just the usual juagen. The juagen was great. Find the counter lady extremely sweet and innocent looking. Unfortunately she just handles the counter, doesn't do massage. My aim is to eventually talk her into giving me a massage.

brs_worid
05-02-2010, 12:22 AM
This place is nice. Good massage, really. but MILFs la...SYT lovers can skip

haha76
05-02-2010, 12:42 AM
return to look for sally but was told she left liao. requested for yenny but was busy. there was another lady jiajia was available but looks CMI so decided to come back another day.

Sally is back to Upper Th****n. pls be gentle, she's a nice lady.

fisher7900
05-02-2010, 10:07 AM
tks bro Doremi for the addr, heres my FR:

Once i got the addr yesterday, make a booking with Yenny during lunch time 12.30pm but was told she will only be in around 12.45 to 1pm. so drive all the way from changi to beach Rd. (the place is quite easy to locate, just along the main road.) Upon reaching saw this pretty syt sitting in the counter thought she is yenny but no (she about 165cm, 45 to 50kg, A+ cup)

She was very polite, told me that Yenny will be arriving in about 10min time, she direct me to the room for a rest. while waiting i almost doze off, all of a sudden i heard foot step walking and a head pop into the room. what stand before me was a tall and gergous lady, she kept apologyise that she was late and kept me waiting. When i look at the time its about 15min that i have waiting for her... anyway, i took 45min as i'm reaching for time. for the next 15min or so, everything was quite SOP for the massage (but its good) and a little chat now and then. what make me awake was she sat in between my legs with me still facing down, and start massaging my butt and butt crack all the way down to my groin area. Its one for the best butt massage i've ever try before, it lasted about 5 to 10 min i think. and was told to turn over. before i can hint her, she already start stroking my little bro who is still sleeping. So i just let her do her stuff :P she start performing her Juagen skill.. and YES i totally again with some bro who said her Juagen is good.. she took her time enjoying and playing with my little bro for a good 15min (Yes a good 15min) she told me that am damn rock hard and long for an average asian guy (sorry to show off abit) she then move and position herself near me and start stroking my dick while i play with her tits... it didnt last long when i shot all my cums sky high and landed all over her hands and arm.

She took a hot towel and help me clean up and i leave the place happy.

Age: mid 30 (~35)
Ht: 165
Wt: 48kg
race: HK
Boobis: 33B+ (but nice big nipple to play with
overall: 7/10
HJ + Juagen: 9.5/10
FJ: NA
BJ: NA
Damage: $35 (45min) + $50 (HJ)

RTF: maybe...

fisher7900
05-02-2010, 11:23 AM
Hello Guys,

I sacrificed my lunch hour to have another session with Hongkong lady Yenny. Just like my previous visit, the massage was excellent. It would have been perfect if I had succeeded in convincing her into a FJ but unfortunately just like the previous time, my attempts failed. No matter how hard I tried, I got rejected. No choice but to settle for just the usual juagen. The juagen was great. Find the counter lady extremely sweet and innocent looking. Unfortunately she just handles the counter, doesn't do massage. My aim is to eventually talk her into giving me a massage.


Bro tks for sharing..

biglan
05-02-2010, 11:37 AM
bro, pls share contact. thanks

D0REMI
05-02-2010, 06:42 PM
[QUOTE=fisher7900;4544912]tks bro Doremi for the addr, heres my FR:

Once i got the addr yesterday, make a booking with Yenny during lunch time 12.30pm but was told she will only be in around 12.45 to 1pm. so drive all the way from changi to beach Rd. (the place is quite easy to locate, just along the main road.) Upon reaching saw this pretty syt sitting in the counter thought she is yenny but no (she about 165cm, 45 to 50kg, A+ cup)QUOTE]



Hello fisher,

the counter girl damn babe right? Its the type of girl most would hope to have as gf or wife. Its also quite rare to find a HongKong lady like Yenny who gives such a solid massage. Would be ideal if the place can have a wider variety of girls

dickmaster
07-02-2010, 10:32 PM
sorry for the long and possibly boring FR,but i thought i'll do it when the details are still fresh and vivid in my mind..

Its been a month since my last massage so was scanning the forums and came across this joint. went today afternoon,like the bro above said ,its easy to find.reached the place and yenny (though i didnt know at the time) was at the counter wearing a black T and mini short .i must say, she is pretty hot. she quoted 40$ for the massage and i didnt bother asking if it was yenny since she was a looker :D . she led me to the room and told me to take of the my clothes..i took off everything and wrapped a towel while got a cup of water..she told me to lie on the bed and told me in a naughty that i should take off my towel..then she started the masssaging the upper half..pretty good skills and she does this nifty move with her knees, few minutes into the massage i ask here name and she says Yenny..then i ask,arent you from HK? shes like..wah,how you know.. i tell her my "friends" have visited her and recommended her massage,she was happy and said thanks...then she moves down to my butt..she gave a very nice and thorough massage..running her lovely hands through the crack..and then rubbing the deep inner groin region..tooo goood....she prob spend 10-15 mins on my nether regions :) it was heavenly then moved to the legs..by this time i was so relaxed i dozed off for a few minutes..then it was time to turn over..she asks the GQ. i ask how much and she says 50. i ask if i can squeeze her boobs..she tells,first she will exercise/massage my equipment and afterwards she will sit beside and let me roam..she asks how well can i control my release..tell her that im not that good..but ok..and then she gives one of the best JG i've ever had..thorough and relaxed..then she takes a stool and sits beside me..she thrusts my hand into the her bra and i feel here lovely melons..i take one hand and run it through her butt crack (my hands were a bit cold ,she was like u brrrrr..cooldd). i asked her if i can put it into her pussy to warm first,she declines that..then i squeeze her boobs and ass like no tomorrow..she says my dick is huge :D, then i suck her boobs and she starts moaning...finally after a few minutes i come and its all over..she asks if want a shower or wipe with hot towel..i choose the latter.she cleans me,and i pay and leave..

MILF : Yenny
AGE : doesnt matter,shes a hottie
Boobs : delicious and soft
ASS : Nice crack :)
Massage : 8.5/10
JG + HJ : 9/10
Damage : 40(M) + 50(HJ)
RTM : Hell YA

ReeveR
08-02-2010, 01:34 AM
hi can pm me the location ? thx lots

LengKia
08-02-2010, 08:42 AM
hi guys, care to share her contact & location. want to drop by..

cheers

fisher7900
08-02-2010, 11:13 AM
[QUOTE=fisher7900;4544912]tks bro Doremi for the addr, heres my FR:

Once i got the addr yesterday, make a booking with Yenny during lunch time 12.30pm but was told she will only be in around 12.45 to 1pm. so drive all the way from changi to beach Rd. (the place is quite easy to locate, just along the main road.) Upon reaching saw this pretty syt sitting in the counter thought she is yenny but no (she about 165cm, 45 to 50kg, A+ cup)QUOTE]



Hello fisher,

the counter girl damn babe right? Its the type of girl most would hope to have as gf or wife. Its also quite rare to find a HongKong lady like Yenny who gives such a solid massage. Would be ideal if the place can have a wider variety of girls

Hi Doremi,

Yeah man, a great petty. but her tits a too small as am a boobs lover.. other then that i guess is alright..

fisher7900
08-02-2010, 11:16 AM
can pm me the contact?

Hi sgfemales,

I dont mind giving you the contact but 1st the owner of this thread have to approve it (DOREMI). its not so good for me to give out the contact without his approval.

sorry bro

mikejsg
08-02-2010, 12:29 PM
Can PM me the address? Thinking of going for a good massage.

Sunflower2006
08-02-2010, 12:31 PM
Bro,
want to try this fantastic outlet too Ctc pls. Many many thanks

dickmaster
08-02-2010, 01:23 PM
actually,all the pointers for deducing the location are already there in the posts.u just need to be a bit resourceful

matrix23
08-02-2010, 10:17 PM
Can PM me the address? Thinking of going for a good massage.

D0REMI
10-02-2010, 09:38 AM
[QUOTE=D0REMI;4546537]

Hi Doremi,

Yeah man, a great petty. but her tits a too small as am a boobs lover.. other then that i guess is alright..


Hello Fisher,

Have not been back there since my visit that day. Talking about her tits, her size is just great for me, prefer a average to a big watermelon..:) Even though have not seen her for quite a few days, her sweet innocent angelic face remains vividly stucked in my thoughts. Has any guy succeeded convertg her to do massage so far? Would not mind tipping her a little extra to just have a decent no hanky panky massage or even just a chat in the cubicle, that will surely be half the battle won..:) Will try pay her a visit before cny, hope to accomplish my mission

popee16
10-02-2010, 01:57 PM
[QUOTE=fisher7900;4544912]tks bro Doremi for the addr, heres my FR:

Once i got the addr yesterday, make a booking with Yenny during lunch time 12.30pm but was told she will only be in around 12.45 to 1pm. so drive all the way from changi to beach Rd. (the place is quite easy to locate, just along the main road.) Upon reaching saw this pretty syt sitting in the counter thought she is yenny but no (she about 165cm, 45 to 50kg, A+ cup)QUOTE]



Hello fisher,

the counter girl damn babe right? Its the type of girl most would hope to have as gf or wife. Its also quite rare to find a HongKong lady like Yenny who gives such a solid massage. Would be ideal if the place can have a wider variety of girls

Hello Bro Doremi,
Thank you very much for the contact. Went yesterday afternoon and book for Yenny, like the bro above said ,its easy to find.reached the place paid the fee $40 at the counter went into the room and took off everything, wrapped a towel and lie on the bed.

Abot five minute, Yenny went in and then she started the masssaging the upper half..pretty good skills and she does the nifty move with her knees, ...then she moves down to my butt..she gave a very nice and thorough massage running her lovely hands through the crack. it was heavenly then moved to the legs. I was so relaxed and dozed off for a while..then it was time to turn over. as usual she asks the GQ.and this is the one of the best JG i've ever had. finally after a few minutes i come and its all over..she asks if want a shower or wipe with hot towel..i choose the latter.she cleans me,and i pay and leave..

MILF : Yenny
AGE : 34+
Boobs : delicious and soft
Massage : 8.5/10
JG + HJ : 9/10
Damage : 40(M) + 50(HJ)
RTM : Hell YA

piglet78
10-02-2010, 03:30 PM
Hi Bro,
Can i have the contacts please..

Thanks

Tomatos
10-02-2010, 05:49 PM
no difficulty finding joint but had real headache finding parking, almost gave up. finally parked at nearby sultan plz multi storey carpk. went to look for the much talk abt yenny but shit man she was fully booked. there was a milf manning counter, recommended me new gal joyce. requested to hv a look at joyce, dont trust all the counter gals recomendation. but when saw joyce, i quickly said ok will take her. joyce is a pretty babe with barbie doll looks. paid the pretty counter lady $40 for the entrance and was ushered into the room. took off my clothes lie on the bed and waited for her... she came in started massage. wow, she sure can massage well, i should say her skill is about 9/10. the pressure that she applied was perfect. she told me that she is from fuzhou. said that today is only her second day at this joint. enjoyed the long conversation with her during whole massage. after i turn over and massaging my tummy, face, she finally asked me softly if i wanted hj. asked her how much and she quoted $50. i signalled ok. she put some oil on my lil bro and begin to slowly carress it. her hj was great. i push up her top and unhook her bra. was quite surprised to see that her boobs are real big mayb abt d-cup, wow! place my hands on her huge melons, the feeling was great. her boobs are so white and smooth and soft. as what i normally do at all joints, asked her to inched closer to me and i started to lick her nipple.as i did that, she continued to pamper my lil bro which is now hardened and so erected. this went on for some mins before i exploded. she cleaned me up and led me to counter to fill up a member card. after dat i went off a contented man.


name: joyce
looks: 8/10 (fair and smooth complexion, pretty with barbie doll looks)
age: 32
tits: d-cup (white, soft and smooth. yummy)
massage: 9/10
hj: 7.5/10
damage: $40 + $50

tepes
11-02-2010, 10:42 PM
Hi Bros,

Went to this joint recently and had yenny...

Yenny
Looks: 7 inside the room, 6 outside... (haha... Due to her facial structure, she actually looked pretty good in dim rooms but perhaps due to lack of maintainence, wear and tear does show a little flaws in full light...)

Body: 6.5 (B cupper, slim)

Massage: defintiely has some standard... not very hard though... dont think it's the same quality as the real hardcore tcm practitioners, but considered very good for non tcm joints.

JG: OUCH... The digging of the balls part is painful man... But have to tahan, since it's supposed to be good for the dick... next week will go take it for a spin and see if it works...

GFE: 10!!!!! This is where she shines... she's such a cool person and we hit it off really well... In fact conversationally this is the most fun session I had with any WL... It's not the sexy you are so good looking type conversation that we had, more like talking cock wth a good friend... More like chatting with an old buddy... except that this friend will end up jerking you off!!

Had lots of fun there, strangly enough.. I enjoyed the conversation even more than the massage and extras... really strange... It's really not the sexy romantic sort of gfe... more like a female buddy that jokes around and end up giving you a handjob for fun... It is not my policy to rtf.... too many choices and too little $$$ and time... But for Yenny.... I may just pay a friend a visit...

As with all my FRs this is my personal opinion and true experience, no offence intended to any bro here.

Cheersm Gong Xi Fa Cai and HUAT AH!!!

babakelvin
12-02-2010, 12:21 AM
[QUOTE=D0REMI;4546537]

Hello Bro Doremi,
Thank you very much for the contact. Went yesterday afternoon and book for Yenny, like the bro above said ,its easy to find.reached the place paid the fee $40 at the counter went into the room and took off everything, wrapped a towel and lie on the bed.

Abot five minute, Yenny went in and then she started the masssaging the upper half..pretty good skills and she does the nifty move with her knees, ...then she moves down to my butt..she gave a very nice and thorough massage running her lovely hands through the crack. it was heavenly then moved to the legs. I was so relaxed and dozed off for a while..then it was time to turn over. as usual she asks the GQ.and this is the one of the best JG i've ever had. finally after a few minutes i come and its all over..she asks if want a shower or wipe with hot towel..i choose the latter.she cleans me,and i pay and leave..

MILF : Yenny
AGE : 34+
Boobs : delicious and soft
Massage : 8.5/10
JG + HJ : 9/10
Damage : 40(M) + 50(HJ)
RTM : Hell YA


visited yenny today, got to agree dat her zuagen is fantastic. great lobang.

ahn17
13-02-2010, 02:42 PM
Best lah... TS, may I have the address please? Thanks!

Promise to write FR.

38Honda
13-02-2010, 02:58 PM
Hi bro can pm the contact, I want a
good massage thanks

redkop09
13-02-2010, 04:30 PM
Hi Bro Doremi,

can give the add . very keen to try out after so many good fr.

Will give my fr once i try it

redkop09
13-02-2010, 04:44 PM
Hi Bro Ts,

Can Pm the contact. in need of good massage after so many good Fr on this spa.

Tks a million

horny_hobbit
14-02-2010, 01:08 AM
Hi bro can pls pm the contact and address thanks man!

wolfwolf
14-02-2010, 03:13 AM
Any kind bros can provide location? Sincerely appreciate,

sayyes77
16-02-2010, 08:47 AM
hi bro,
can pm the location?
Thanks

jasonyap
16-02-2010, 08:53 AM
pls PM contact

patcantm
16-02-2010, 11:58 AM
Hi Bro... good FR. Can PM me the contact and location. Thanks.

D0REMI
17-02-2010, 08:33 AM
Happy CNY Buddies!

Yenny went for a week long chinese new yr break & will only be back on next mon (22/02/2010). There are two other ladies with huge boobs (at least d-cup). Found out their names, Linda & Joyce. Prefer smaller breast ladies so I will stick to Yenny & wait for her to get back from her break. Bros with big boobs fetish can enjoy them.

4eyemonk
17-02-2010, 09:50 PM
Hi bros, fantastic news: Jua Gen Queen Yenny will be back to work tomorrow thursday 18th Feb.

g2000
17-02-2010, 10:16 PM
Hi Bro

Mind sharing contact?

Thanks

D0REMI
18-02-2010, 09:40 AM
Hi bros, fantastic news: Jua Gen Queen Yenny will be back to work tomorrow thursday 18th Feb.


Hello 4eyemonk,

You sure Yenny coming back to work today? Great, will call during lunch to make a booking.

boybakang
19-02-2010, 06:57 PM
hi doremi,

can pass me address and contact of the place?

tried that jua gen in bangkok and looking for that here in SG liao

patcantm
20-02-2010, 11:37 AM
Thanks Bro DOREMI for the contact.

Took half day and went down yesterday afternoon. Was in luck... Yenny was available and I immediately request recept to assign her to me. Session started off with a good and hard massage... one of the best I have tried. This was followed by her aclaimed Jungen. I must agreed that her skilled is very good. At the beginning can feel slight pain but still can tahan. We ended with HJ and she help clean up with wet tower. Overall, a good sexperience. Will RFT.

rajjnu
20-02-2010, 02:37 PM
sounds like good place for a soothing good rub. ts pls pm me location thanks :)

aries3288
20-02-2010, 02:48 PM
Second attempt to get Yennin to massage but unsuccessful. Call up to make appointment and was told that she is on leave today.

sglonewolf
20-02-2010, 03:43 PM
hi bro may i know where this is? thanks.

boybakang
20-02-2010, 10:53 PM
lolz!!!

finally found it by reading each page of this thread XD

yes bro yenni on leave today too bad! according to receptionist she is quite busy everyday

D0REMI
22-02-2010, 10:04 PM
Hello Guys, have just replied all PMs.

BcupLover
23-02-2010, 12:30 AM
Bro DoReMi... i looked around the area for weeks but can't find. can you pm me? Thanks! <desperate>

botakjoe
23-02-2010, 02:10 PM
mind pm me ctc pls? thanks

4eyemonk
24-02-2010, 08:52 AM
Thanks Bro DOREMI for the contact.

Took half day and went down yesterday afternoon. Was in luck... Yenny was available and I immediately request recept to assign her to me. Session started off with a good and hard massage... one of the best I have tried. This was followed by her aclaimed Jungen. I must agreed that her skilled is very good. At the beginning can feel slight pain but still can tahan. We ended with HJ and she help clean up with wet tower. Overall, a good sexperience. Will RFT.


Hi bro, agree that it is quite difficult to get a slot with Yenni especially during lunch period. She was unavailable when I went down 2 days ago. A older lady CoCo massage me instead. Massage was good but find that she is a little too old for me. Therefore didn't take up her GQ offer.

Some info on CoCo:

Age: ard 40
Look: 6/10
Ht: ard 1.60
Wt: ard 55kg Quite fat
Massage skill: 9/10
Price: Massage (45min) = $35
Attitude: 8/10

Chess
24-02-2010, 09:38 PM
This my 2nd visit, 1st was joyce today was yenni. Both have their plus point.
Joyce massage was hard and solid but know nothing about JG (HJ only) pay $50 too much cos i tot she can JG . Yenni massage soft side but know JG. Those JG goes will know that her JG still got room for improvment.

Thanks you for giving me the ctc

Her the stat,

Joyce
Look: 7-8/10
Figure 8/10
Massage skill: 8/10
Attitude: 9/10
H/J: 8/10 can auto roam

Yenni
Look: 7-8/10
Figure 8/10
Massage skill: 6/10
Attitude: 9/10
JG : 6/10
H/J: 8/10 can auto roam

cavemanng
25-02-2010, 07:05 AM
Can pm me location?

shortshooter
25-02-2010, 07:06 PM
Hi Bro,
Can share the location?
Thanks.

Bronco
25-02-2010, 07:40 PM
First of all thanks bro doremi for sharing the lobang and managed find the place.

Tis afternoon 12 pm called up booked for yenni and she available @2pm.

The location is facing the main rd, is the row shop btw the 2 makan shop near the corner,walk up the staircase.

Lucky reached ther b4 2pm the place no ppl ,quickly go to counter tell her I'm bronco booked for yenni. She lead me to the cubicle room. Lest than a min yenni come in.

Her look quite ok to me and she quite frenly tokcock with me in Cantonese.

Her massage consider no bad but her JG more better.

She quite jovial tease me tat my sword too rusty, need to come more often for polishing..hahaha :D

After catch the dragon vein btw ur balls then follow hand job to flush the system, tat time she allowed u to auto roam her breasts...:D

Conclusion: feel sextified and total damaged 40 + 50 + tip.

Pls do not PM me for her ctc, ask the TS instead..Kum sia..:)

EBloGGeR
25-02-2010, 07:48 PM
Location?? Wo to pm

D0REMI
26-02-2010, 08:39 AM
Hi Buddies,

have replied all your PMs.

cavemanng
26-02-2010, 10:37 AM
I call them yesteday, Linda n Joyce no longer there. Receptionist say both busy and dunno when come back.

BcupLover
26-02-2010, 10:06 PM
First of all, thanks to Bro DoReMi...
i found the place finally and this is my 1st FR and a newbie to the world of sexsation :)

2 weeks of hunting the place after reading the thread i gave up and ask Bro DoReMi for directions. i went up and Yenny was not available, so i booked a 1pm session 2 days ago.

Appointment day
i was excited with the ratings given for her on her looks, i went up then saw a fair complexion auntie on the counter. i told her had appt with Yenni, i didn't get her her reply-cos she mumbled & i asked again. she said she is Yenny. i was "opps" taken aback, impression smashed. She asked politely; 可以吗? Then i say ok loh, cos it has been 6 mths no massage (clean ones, not referring to hanky panky). She lead the way with her back facing me, I SCREENED HER FROM HER BACK OF HER HEAD TO HER HEELS; now i know why she earned such good ratings. long silky hair, good body shape, nice bums, slim legs. then in the room. she ask do i want a drink?! i said wow, why not. :p
she left the room and i look around and took my top off. wow she's back! knn so fast. i not done taking off yet. she stood there waiting for me, then i asked, 底裤也要脱吗? then she smiled, 要啊!要不然怎么按摸呢? LL, then everything off.

>> forgot to elborate her dressing that day. low V white tank top with lacy sneaking bra on the edge of her top... Oh Man! she has a deep V canal. she's wearing a very short tight skirt - Jeans type... we talked during my session in cantonese...

Massage
me facing down....
comparing to the decent massage i had, she's good. hard finger press, strong elbows drags etc... then the knees comes up.. the balianese style.. i like the part where her knees on my hips. very good feeling... sourish press.... then comes something i never had before. she sat between my knees (most of ther time she is sitting at this position) i think she like to peep on our shafts! :) she held her fist together and sensually thrust from slightly touching my balls and upwards to my butt and it repeated 3 times slowly.. never felt so good! Orh @.@. then her right hand went into grab my left groin and purposely feel my balls again and vice versa with her left hand to my right groin... WAH... feels good.. oooff.. but i did not have a hard on. cos i she her face in the bright light at the counter and she's not my cup of tea. after that, she played with my B-cup for 15 mins and purposely felt my arshole a few occasions. Air con was cold. Masssage was good. really good. then she stopped, dimmed the lights about 50% and pat my shoulder to turn around.

me facing up now...
she popped the GQ.... asks me want JG? i think must be time is running out as she spent quite some time on my hard back & shoulders. i nodded and said ok. she sat between my knees again. she started holding my shaft with her left and my balls on her right. proceedure begins. there was slight discomfort but bearable. i felt it is not the real JG cos i read on an article how a JG should be like (Lingam Massage (http://www.whitelotuseast.com/LingamMassage.htm)). all these while my bro was at ease. no reaction. partly maybe it's too cold and she's not my type.. but after awhile i tot (while she's trying hard to make me turn, cos she was already stroking my shaft and she used her right index finger & sexsually glide from my asehole upwards to my ballls many times) damn, i'm already paying for the JG $, why not let her jerk me off! :) dun waste $... heee... so i ask her to come over i want to touch her... she sat beside me and my right hand felt hesoft smooth body and moving towards to unclip the bra... then she says.. cannot cannot... dangerous, wait cannot react if thing happen. having said that, she took my left hand & insert into her left breast to feel her soft supple boobs and the "blueberry"... man... felt good. should have been a B cup. but too soft for my liking cos i like firm ones.. began sucking it and i sling down her left spegetti & bra stripe... enjoying every moment of it. after awhile... "proofff, proofff, proofff" wow man.. i felt my warm millions on my left thighs... it has never felt soo good...
she then cover my hard on shaft with the small towel and went out to fetch a warm towel in to wipe. (cos she asked me earlier & i told her i dun wan to bathe, wipe will do)
she's wiped my balls, shaft, ase, thighs.... then she helped me up and says session finished. i cleaned up myself again, dressed up and paid her while she's in the room with me all the while. finished my drink, went out and enrolled as member (that pay 5 get 1 free)

sorry for the long write.. hope you like my FR...

Looks: 5/10 (not my type)
Boobs: 6.5/10 (soft B but me preferred a firm B... that's why i'm a BcupLover)
Figure: 7.5/10
Massage: 9.5/10
Attitude: 9.5/10
JG: 8/10
HJ: 8.5/10 (with the help of autoroam ... )
Damage: $40 (1 hr) + $50 (JG)

any bros suggest which gal is better there? Jolin or Joyce? can autoroam?

D0REMI
27-02-2010, 12:45 AM
any bros suggest which gal is better there? Jolin or Joyce? can autoroam?


Hi bro, Linda is good.

kenphil21
27-02-2010, 10:20 AM
All brothers. I notice many of u ask for the address and brioether Doremi is so secretive about it. Share it lah.

Anyway, the shop is call D'Oriental and it is locate at 349B, Beach Road. ( 2nd shop from the corner steamboat restaurant ). So, i hope nobody will waste time to ask stupid question like please pm me the contact and so on.

There are 5 china girls here.

Yenny - from another HC and the boobs are really no big deal. A+ size and also sagging. Puzzy is quite bare as well.

Joyce - C boobs and virgin forest in the puzzy.

Linda - C cup also and quite bushy down south

Judy - D cup but almost like desert down there

Jolene - cup B but not allowed to roam puzzy ( so, no comment )

The winner is : JOYCE

Hope you guys get the 'right' person and make no complaint.

BcupLover
27-02-2010, 04:01 PM
wow bro kenphil21... you have completed the conquest? my salute to you :)

how did you managed to fully autoroam the whole world map? any skills to impart?
any ratings for looks? me not keen in FJ....
most importantly, solid massage w roaming & HJ on the conquest. :p

MrAnalyst
28-02-2010, 03:39 AM
All brothers. I notice many of u ask for the address and brioether Doremi is so secretive about it. Share it lah.

Anyway, the shop is call D'Oriental and it is locate at 349B, Beach Road. ( 2nd shop from the corner steamboat restaurant ). So, i hope nobody will waste time to ask stupid question like please pm me the contact and so on.

There are 5 china girls here.

Yenny - from another HC and the boobs are really no big deal. A+ size and also sagging. Puzzy is quite bare as well.

Joyce - C boobs and virgin forest in the puzzy.

Linda - C cup also and quite bushy down south

Judy - D cup but almost like desert down there

Jolene - cup B but not allowed to roam puzzy ( so, no comment )

The winner is : JOYCE

Hope you guys get the 'right' person and make no complaint.

after reading many posts , finally get the complete post that I waiting for.Why so secretive bros..? Whenever I came to this forum , every single thread trying to be secretive about contacts and location.Why are you guys hiding for ? Afraid that the shops and the girls will be catch by police if you guys share contacts and location here ? I just don't understand..If the polices are reading this post, may be they are customers too ..millions thanks kenphil21 for complete post..we need a lot of members like kenphil21 .Pardon me if I offend anyone.I am just sharing how I feel :)

cgcgcg
28-02-2010, 04:48 AM
after reading many posts , finally get the complete post that I waiting for.Why so secretive bros..? Whenever I came to this forum , every single thread trying to be secretive about contacts and location.Why are you guys hiding for ? Afraid that the shops and the girls will be catch by police if you guys share contacts and location here ? I just don't understand..If the polices are reading this post, may be they are customers too ..millions thanks kenphil21 for complete post..we need a lot of members like kenphil21 .Pardon me if I offend anyone.I am just sharing how I feel :)

when you refer to some newspapers, the shop owners put the shop number, handphone number , shop address and shop name big big.

For eg, if the TS states "Oriental wellness:.......", same as the shop name, think we should share the location openly. If not, full page are bros asking for contact.

If the TS just put " Beach Road: Pretty MILFs super .....", then we should share the contact via PM.

4eyemonk
01-03-2010, 04:33 PM
wow bro kenphil21... you have completed the conquest? my salute to you :)

how did you managed to fully autoroam the whole world map? any skills to impart?
any ratings for looks? me not keen in FJ....
most importantly, solid massage w roaming & HJ on the conquest. :p


This is a joint for a good solid massage. It is certainly not a place for extreme hanky panky. Girls at most provide HJ.

cumhere
02-03-2010, 05:26 PM
I was there yesterday and booked Yenny....

Initially went to the wrong spa and the lady boss kept asking me why so many bros go up there looking for Yenny and even ask me whats so good about her that everyone looking for her........oh well........thats another story


Well, i went to the spa and massage started out really great and she really used her strength and legs to massage me releiving me all the stress. Whats most important here is that her character is completely friendly and i chatted with her throughout the session (note that sometimes i hate to talk to the masseurs since i want to enjoy my massage) but with Yenny, it felt totally at ease.

After the nice massage, i flipped over and she just said "you want jua gen right" and yeah of cuz! told her thats the reason why i went there.....
Whilst doing it , i asked her whats it for etc and she provided me a really lengthy explanation of what jua gen is and the benefits of it (its totally different from HJ or those normal press balls abit type).... with jua gen, she could tell certain things about my lifestyle, sexual style etc which impressed me
Anyway, after the jua gen, prick was standing real high and HARD...think it must be due to the jua gen since there was totally nothing sexual during that period and we were normal chatting serious matters (hahah benefits of jua gen)

Next she said its done and time to release the bad elements...she proceeded over to my side and HJ me.... after a while, I said i cant release cuz no inspiration (actually perhaps cuz it was nothing sexual in the session) and then she just said...why do u think i sit beside you? go grab some tits... next, she put my hands in to grab her tits.

Perhaps I was too tired but i jsut couldnt come for so long and i think it must have been 20mins and can see that her hands are really tired. I had actually wanted to ask her to stop since i was not in the mood but since part of the benefits of jua gen is to release the 'dirty stuff', i din want to waste it..... after much grabbing and fantasizing, i shot my load out and was really glad that her service was top-notch. She did not complain at all that i took so long

For service wise and massage, Yenny is really a good one.......but if u are thinking more along the time of somethign more sexual, then go FL

My two cents worth

D0REMI
02-03-2010, 06:41 PM
I was there yesterday and booked Yenny....

Initially went to the wrong spa and the lady boss kept asking me why so many bros go up there looking for Yenny and even ask me whats so good about her that everyone looking for her........oh well........thats another story.....

After the nice massage, i flipped over and she just said "you want jua gen right" and yeah of cuz! told her thats the reason why i went there.....
Whilst doing it , i asked her whats it for etc and she provided me a really lengthy explanation of what jua gen is and the benefits of it (its totally different from HJ or those normal press balls abit type).... with jua gen, she could tell certain things about my lifestyle, sexual style etc which impressed me
Anyway, after the jua gen, prick was standing real high and HARD...think it must be due to the jua gen since there was totally nothing sexual during that period and we were normal chatting serious matters (hahah benefits of jua gen)



I suppose many bros went up to the wrong joint. Maybe they ended up going to Wellness Massage near the beach road big prawn noodle. Yenny is at D'Oriental Wellness Spa, which is actually near the corner of Aliwal St (Beach Rd side). Mayb it was my mistake that led to the confusion, the shop name actually is D'Oriental Spa.

cumhere
02-03-2010, 11:16 PM
I suppose many bros went up to the wrong joint. Maybe they ended up going to Wellness Massage near the beach road big prawn noodle. Yenny is at D'Oriental Wellness Spa, which is actually near the corner of Aliwal St (Beach Rd side). Mayb it was my mistake that led to the confusion, the shop name actually is D'Oriental Spa.

Yeah, D'Oriental is at beach road nearer to JSP.

The wrong joint is called Wellness spa, also at beach road, nearer to Arab Street

The lady at Wellness spa was kind enough and did not pester me to try their ladies when i was already inside there..... she just said 'next time come try'

So any bros tried there?

Tomatos
04-03-2010, 08:41 AM
Joyce - C boobs and virgin forest in the puzzy.

The winner is : JOYCE

Hope you guys get the 'right' person and make no complaint.


bro kenphil21, wat do u mean by "virgin forest in the puzzy"??? do u mean she got a forest, hairy pussy??? sounds interesting but cant figure out wat u mean by it

KennyL
04-03-2010, 10:39 PM
went up to try yenny this afternoon
in short, was a disappointment for me, given my high expectations from other bros FR

yenny tried to differentiate her hj/juagen by rubbing my dick lightly with her nails
but i think that was a poor attempt, since it really felt weird and i was constantly worried her nails might cut my delicate 2IC skin ;-)


looks: 6/10 (late 30s, not really chio)

figure: 8/10 (but no use, since she did not even take off her blouse)

hj: 6/10 (was disappointed that she did not take off her top, only inserted my hands into her blouse) not value for $, considering what I get from other place for 40+50

massage: 7/10, reasonable, not piano-playing... but told her my neck was tired when her fingers reached there.. but it was clear she ignored what I said and did not proceed to press my neck for longer

service: 7/10 (maybe becos of language barriers, she did not get my realtime massage feedback in mandarin)

RTM: NO (did not enjoy her nails-juagen, did not massage my aching body parts more after I told her to do so, only allowed few mins for autoroaming - and with blouse on, somemore)

redkop09
05-03-2010, 01:12 AM
Tks to Bro Doremi for the contact

redkop09
05-03-2010, 01:18 AM
Tks to Bro Doremi for the contact.

Managed to book yenny on last fr evening, Before i could change, Yenny came in with a warm cup of water. TCSS before the massage. I am not used to hard massage but I would say that I enjoy the massage. She really noes her stuff.

Turn over and pop the GQ while touching little bro. Her JG was good for me though feel a little painful which she say is normal. Her skin is really smooth to feel and steam sia...the rest need not me to further explain..pew pew out my little soldier..

Look: Presentable
Attitute: 8/10
Massage: 8/10
JG: 8/10
RTF: Sure

Above is my personal opinion....:)

BcupLover
05-03-2010, 01:34 AM
Bro KennyL...
can you PM me your "other places" which is more value for $?
is it around the area as well?

thanks so much..

Jamester999
05-03-2010, 11:25 PM
just tried yenny last week, finally.

place's ambience is quite nice. not big but managed to looks good with
good lighting.

as a whole, she look decent enough. maybe a 7/10 first impression.

massage skills is really not bad. she make me feel i might really
want to make a return soon. better than a lot others in other places. 7.5/10
i like the way she apply extra strength on certain areas when needed to.
felt she got good control over it..

character/feeling wise .. quite chatable, very friendly, and humorous.
she likes to laugh out really loud when she feels like it. (makes me a little nervous coz i'm sure the whole place can hear lol).
she makes the session comfortable.

JG. ok my first time (i think). what i experienced here my first time.
to be honest .. a little too painful for me. almost like torturing.
maybe it's coz it's my first time and i'm not used to it yet.
i'm actually hoping it will pass soon.. and i'm in no way a position to
grade this JG coz i'm not even sure it's supposed to be this way,
and i can't feel much of a after-effect (maybe need couple more times)
after that. so hmmmmmm ....

HJ. sadly to say, not really fantastic. beginning was not bad, when it was sensual a little, then it start to became a little too routine for me.
it's not very bad, but it wasn't one of the best neither.
7/10 for me.

bottomline is, i think i will definately return for her massage.
for JG, .. maybe not (i afraid of pain leh ... :( )
hj, occassionally ok.

curious to try others too

D0REMI
06-03-2010, 03:05 PM
Hi Buddy,

if you are looking for excellent massage, you should ask for either Yenny, Joyce, Linda or Miko. If you like someone younger and prettier, then should look for Jolin.

4eyemonk
08-03-2010, 01:48 PM
Hi bro, is joyce still working there? Been there on a few occasions and she is always not around. Had a new lady by the name of miko, a pretty face milf with c cup boobs. Her massage is damn good.

Some info on her:

Age: ard 30
Look: 7.5/10 (pretty milf)
Ht: ard 1.67
Boobs: c
Massage skill: 9/10
Hj: 8/10
Attitude: 9/10
Damage: $40 + $50

Caneman
08-03-2010, 03:29 PM
Bro could you pm me contact please. Many thanks

Caneman
08-03-2010, 03:36 PM
Bro could you pm me contact please. Many thanks

Caneman
08-03-2010, 03:44 PM
Bro could you pm me contact please. Many thanks

need_massage
08-03-2010, 09:10 PM
H,
Just had a session with Yenny. Thanks to Doremi for the location. The location is bit obvious just opposite to concourse east to find. I went upstair and asked for Yenny. She was available i was lucky. I took 1 hr massage and went to the room and waited.
Yenny came and she looks like typical aunty, she is from HK. She started with the massage. She is very friendly. The massage was very solid and was too good.
When she reaches the leg she often tickle the groin area. I love the massage session it was too good.
Then flip over she asked wanna try HJ, the rate was 50 $ i said ok then she took the position and sat just io front of me make me spread my leg wide. Then she started the juagen, she arose my didi first using the nerve and then down by massaging the balls, then arouse again. It was soo nice. Then she massage the head with finger tips and slowly moved dwon using the nail. It was shoik she done that for 10 min, then she started doing HJ and allowed auro roam, her boobs are bit small and smooth.

Finally mine was rock hard and shooted. Then asked me wanna shower or wash. I op[ted to clean, then she done pressure point massage and then went to take hot towel and cleaned using it.

Massage 9/10
Juagen 9/10
Look Normal aunty
Danmage: 40 for 1 hr massage and 50 for juagen

Sure will go again

fooklaikeong
08-03-2010, 11:02 PM
went there after work n tis time girl msg for me called ice. she is new told me she formerly from beijing 101. and her msg was dam dam good. can tell tat she really came from proper trained msg. her hj is quite sensual. allow me to touch only her tits wh is quite big. damage is $35 for 45min msg + $50 for hj

4eyemonk
09-03-2010, 08:09 AM
went there after work n tis time girl msg for me called ice. she is new told me she formerly from beijing 101. and her msg was dam dam good. can tell tat she really came from proper trained msg. her hj is quite sensual. allow me to touch only her tits wh is quite big. damage is $35 for 45min msg + $50 for hj


Hi Bro, Beijing 101 has produced quite a few excellent massage ladies who are able to use a towel to crack the joints of your neck. Is Moon able to to it?

darknezz
09-03-2010, 08:46 AM
H,
Just had a session with Yenny. Thanks to Doremi for the location. The location is bit obvious just opposite to concourse east to find. I went upstair and asked for Yenny. She was available i was lucky. I took 1 hr massage and went to the room and waited.
Yenny came and she looks like typical aunty, she is from HK. She started with the massage. She is very friendly. The massage was very solid and was too good.
When she reaches the leg she often tickle the groin area. I love the massage session it was too good.
Then flip over she asked wanna try HJ, the rate was 50 $ i said ok then she took the position and sat just io front of me make me spread my leg wide. Then she started the juagen, she arose my didi first using the nerve and then down by massaging the balls, then arouse again. It was soo nice. Then she massage the head with finger tips and slowly moved dwon using the nail. It was shoik she done that for 10 min, then she started doing HJ and allowed auro roam, her boobs are bit small and smooth.

Finally mine was rock hard and shooted. Then asked me wanna shower or wash. I op[ted to clean, then she done pressure point massage and then went to take hot towel and cleaned using it.

Massage 9/10
Juagen 9/10
Look Normal aunty
Danmage: 40 for 1 hr massage and 50 for juagen

Sure will go again


does yenny do outcals or anything more than hj? prefer to have session in the comfort zone of my home or hotel room... more privacy

D0REMI
10-03-2010, 09:27 AM
does yenny do outcals or anything more than hj? prefer to have session in the comfort zone of my home or hotel room... more privacy

Hi Buddy,

nope Yenny does not provide any outcalls or anything other than HJ. Had a session with Yenny on monday and was told by counter aunty that there are two new ladies, Miko and Ice. Didn't get to see Ice. Saw Miko, quite good looking.

Hitman316
13-03-2010, 12:48 PM
Visited 2-3 weeks ago. Wanted Yenny bt she nt ard. Rcep recommended Joyce...said she nt too bad...so y nt?

The place was nice and new, one of the nicest massage place that I have visited. The dim lightings make it even more cozy. The recept led me to the room, waited a while for Joyce before she finally came into the room. The massage nt too bad...got strength and pressure. She told me she trained in Beijing...dunno how true is tt though. After a while seeing my lil bro is standing, she popped the magic qn. I said yes. So while she sensationally massage my brother, I move my hands below her T-shirt and fondle her boobs.

After not so long, I exploded. She went to take a warm towel to clean me up. The feeling was pretty gd. After that she gave me a cup of hot tea. Great service!


looks: 7/10
body: 7/10
boobs: c-cup
massage: 8.5/10 (good strength and well trained)
HJ: 6.5/10 (Quite SOP)
Damage: $40 (massage) + $50(HJ)
RTF: Maybe, want to try Yenny too

Hitman316
13-03-2010, 02:05 PM
Tried Joyce 2-3 wks ago...early 30s MILF...trained in beijing (based on wat she said) and from her massage, it seemed to be true...strong and pressure at all the right places...so when she said if i wanna HJ, i said y nt...so there my hands go...doing all the roaming while she tried to make my lil bro explode...and when it did, it was a pretty gd feeling :)

Age: Early 30s
Look: 7/10 (pretty milf)
Boobs: C
Massage skill: 8/10
Hj: 6.5/10
Attitude: 7.5/10
Damage: $40 + $50
RTM: Maybe bt want to try Yenny 1st

D0REMI
14-03-2010, 12:20 PM
Hello Buddies,

D'Oriental Wellness will be closed one week for renovations. They adding more rooms, heard that there will be a attic.

BcupLover
15-03-2010, 04:56 PM
Bro Doremi...

Closed for a week? starting when you know?

william123
16-03-2010, 11:22 PM
hi buddy,

if you are looking for excellent massage, you should ask for either yenny, joyce, linda or miko. If you like someone younger and prettier, then should look for jolin.

hi ts and bros,
can pm me the address n contact?really look for this excellent massage.
Brgds

granidino
17-03-2010, 12:58 AM
Hi Bro Kikomilla may I have the add and contact? I like Zhua Gen. feels good.. Thank you in advance

keshin
23-03-2010, 10:21 AM
Found the location yesterday evening but it's locked... It's not open yet or not operating in the evening??

Handsome2008
26-03-2010, 09:40 PM
I also found the location and confirmed the place is locked. Seem like it has been closed for a few days, i guess.

shark89
03-04-2010, 02:34 PM
Went past this place a couple of days ago. Door still locked. Was it raided? TS no updates?

newcomer
04-04-2010, 01:08 AM
can you share the contact? Thank you!

mupl70
04-04-2010, 01:32 AM
can pm me the location? thk

Brazzers
04-04-2010, 06:51 PM
Went past this place last nite also .Doors are locked ..

Any bros can confirm is this place is still operational ?

liovinci
07-04-2010, 08:30 AM
Hi bro,

would love to try her massage too...
kindly pm me details... thanks =)

liovinci
07-04-2010, 08:50 AM
Hi bro,

would love to try her massage too...
kindly pm me details... thanks =)

Jamester999
09-04-2010, 07:40 PM
wanted to went down today

gave the shop a call

infact twice

no answer

looks like closing for long time

dunno when open again ..

joe0uk
28-04-2010, 11:13 AM
Went over yesterday, seems this place is closed for good. You could see all the unread mail lying by the entrance.

Joe

allankok33
28-04-2010, 12:20 PM
Can anyone share the location. thanks

richie_rich
28-04-2010, 02:06 PM
Can anyone share the location. thanks

don't waste your time lah. open your eyes and read the above posts and you will know that this place is gone lah.

tepes
23-05-2010, 02:15 PM
Hi Bros,

For those of you looking for and missing the services of Yenny, I found her haha... She can be found in the joint below, she now uses the name of Coco. Told me that once the beach road joint re-opens she will rejoin this joint. But for now parking herself there temporarily.

http://www.sammyboyforum.com/health-centre-ktv-lounge-tangos/182076-36d-gorgeous-milf-boat-quay-new-sentir-massage-5.html

Cheers and happy hunting...

calista_ng
24-05-2010, 09:59 AM
hello guys,

i found a new wellness joint called oriental welllness just opposite my work place. Was there yesterday evening with my working buddy to check out the place and the standard of the ladies. Found it to be a very nicely renovated and extremely cozy wellness place. Was very impressed by the decor of the place. There were only 3 ladies there during the time i went. All 3 of the are very pleasant looking milfs, i guess their ages should be between late twenties to very early 30s. It is definitely not a place for guys looking for pretty syt. Took a 1hr package that includes a free bodyscrub. I picked a lady called yenny, to me she is the prettiest of the 3 while my colleague chose sally. This is also definitely not a place for guys looking for exciting sex and wild hanky panky, as we found out the only hj is provided. I tried my utmost best to convince yenny into a fj, even to the extent of tempting her with more and more cash but was flatly rejected. My colleague also got the same response from his lady. So i guess it is just a good relax joint with at most a hj special. But overall, we found that this is definitely a wonderful wellness place for us who want to have a good massage, rest and relax with a little hj to destress. So it is just suited for guys who loves to have a good massage by pleasant looking milfs.


Statistics of yenny:
Looks: 7.5/10
boobs: Nice smooth and firm c-cup
massage: 7.5/10
hj: 8/10 partial autoroam with light kisses on lips
attitude: 9/10 extremely friendly and good service

statistics of sally (according to my colleague)
looks: 7/10
boobs: Nice smooth c+ cup
massage: 8.5/10
hj: 8.5/10 partial autoroam
attitude: 8.5/10

bro can you pm me yenny contact no

FiveCees
10-07-2010, 12:54 AM
Happen to pass by and saw banner with contact - 6298 0598 for anyone who keen to do booking. Recept had a sweet voice, but is new and do not do massage. I gave a call to the number but did not go up as on my way to GM.

sowhat
10-07-2010, 09:46 AM
Hey bro,

Can pm me e contacts and location. Thanks

Cunt
13-08-2010, 12:34 PM
i think this place re opened but not sure is it still the same management...

Steelshaft
13-08-2010, 06:06 PM
Happen to pass by and saw banner with contact - 6298 0598 for anyone who keen to do booking. Recept had a sweet voice, but is new and do not do massage. I gave a call to the number but did not go up as on my way to GM.

Hi Bro

Looking for a good massage can PM me the place? Thanks!

ryutaroman2
22-09-2010, 02:01 AM
this Spa is named and number is stated. Anyone bother to verify?

Dunno is its the same one I pass by before, rather new and they wear uniform- those thai massage pants. Saw a chio MILF. I didnt take up any massage there as I was just passing by...

will try to track this down.

stevenpainkille
17-11-2010, 11:13 PM
bro tepes, can pm me coco's new location and tel? thanks bro!

Jonesey
30-12-2010, 11:24 AM
Please send contact info, thanks.

teaBag13
30-12-2010, 04:58 PM
Bro mindsharing the location of this place?thanks..

tttsssaw
31-12-2010, 10:38 AM
Appreciate any bro can share with of the location or contact please..
Thanks in adv, Doremi Bro

marcmedow
19-01-2011, 12:00 AM
need a massage and my regular is not free. sianz.... well walk by this place along and decided to give it a try..

went up and was greeted by the recep and was told $42 per hour damage.. hmn ok pay up and went into the room. ambience was ok enough and quite a clean joint. .

was assigned an MILF who hails from HK....speak a mixture of cantonese and chinese..
her massage was surprisingly good...enough strength and know where to attack...not bad ....below is the FR of her

Name: Mango, from HK
age: never ask, MILF
looks: 6.5
massage: 8.5 (really good stuff) definitely not piano type
Boobs: 36C
JG: 7/10
service: overall, good proper massage with JG skills..
damage: $42 (entrance) + $60..
autoroam: allowed.

sendmebeer
22-01-2011, 04:57 PM
pm me contact details please

sendmebeer
22-01-2011, 05:03 PM
pm me the details to please

ryutaroman2
14-02-2011, 11:23 PM
This place seems very quiet... Any regulars care to update?
Saw a chik milf inuniform before-- rather tall and quite nice body, not fat at all-- sizzling. That was quite a while a go when they just open-- any update or any bro knows here name?

strike_gem
19-02-2011, 12:41 PM
Went up to this place recently....chk with recep who is available n to my surpise she mentioned Mango so I decided to try since bros had mentioned her.

Overall she is q service oriented,will try to start a conversation...but her canto slang v thick...cannot catch some of the things she trying to say.:confused:

Age: Mid 30s MILF
Looks: Abt 6.0 consider her age
Massage: 8 for bro who like a gd massage
Boobs: 36C
JG: 6/10
Service: Good :D

ryutaroman2
20-02-2011, 03:03 AM
finally went in to try out.
clean
curtain room
1 common bathroom
uniformed.balck T shirt with Thai fisherman pants.

took the room furtherst inside. not ideal on a busy day. The ladies pick up towels and customers entering the bathroom make alot of noise. not relaxing, specially with curtain door.

eileen
MILF 40s
nice pleasent personality. rather lao chio. like the sexy misstress from next door.
body: (tits) 8.5/10 huge round honey dew sized melon, pink nips.
msg: 7/10 passable. not piano yet nothing too fantastic. relaxing enough.
JG: 6.8/10 she got this scratching thingy with her nails going on the balls not sure I like it too much. Estee frm Dorris still the best .
autoroam allowed.
dmg 36/45min + 50 JG
RTM: yes

donfool
24-02-2011, 03:20 AM
Hey Bro, can PM location? Thanks

qss_1999
25-04-2011, 10:18 PM
Hi bro,mind sharing yenny's contact and location? wanna give a try on the service...much thanks.

ryutaroman2
11-07-2011, 02:33 AM
any updates on this place?

strike_gem
11-07-2011, 12:49 PM
quite a long while never been there...not too sure is still open.

Chanlh
15-01-2012, 12:43 AM
Hi bro, can pm me the contact no for oriental wellness? Tks

ryutaroman2
28-02-2012, 02:25 AM
mango left, eileen left long time ago.
anyone any idea where the go?

the lao chio recep abit dominatrix looking looks good tho- dont know if she msg. every time i go she give me death stare so dont dare to ask.

samuel80
06-03-2012, 03:11 PM
bro, appreciate you could share the exact location. itchy.:)
cheers,
sam

Hello Fooklaikeong, if it is beside a chinese mala steamboat T-one then it should be the 1. Nice place right?

excelsior12345
06-03-2012, 06:14 PM
Visited today.Called to book Yenny at 8pm.
The place was nice and new, one of the nicest massage place that I have visited. The dim lightings make it even more cozy. The recept led me to the room, waited a while for Yenny before she finally came into the room. Yenny told me she is from HongKong. Wow! First time get HK girl doing massage for me.The massage is really very good with strength and pressure, very professional. Can say she is one of the best that ever massage me. She told me she was trained by a Sifu from shanghai. The shanghai master also taught her the true art of ZhuaGen. She asked me to try it. Her ZhuaGen technique seems to be very professional. It lasted for about 15mins and then she ask me whether I want to release. I said yes. She then applied more oil onto my already standing dicky. She sensationally massage the area around my brother. I move my hands below her T-shirt and fondle her boobs.
She then lift up her t-shirt and bra. I slowly suck her boobs while she massge my brother. After not so long, I exploded. She went to take a warm towel to clean me up. The feeling was great. After that she gave me a cup of hot tea. Great service!


looks: 8/10
body: 7.5/10
boobs: b-cup
massage: 9.5/10 (good strength and well trained)
ZhuGen: 9/10
Damage: $40 (massage) + $50(ZhuaGen+Hj)
RTF: yes


is zhugen supposed to be painful. never tried it before and am curious.

ryutaroman2
08-03-2012, 02:31 AM
yes- hardly find any real good ones. also afraid if dunno how to do may damage the little b.

badboynani17
08-03-2012, 05:47 PM
Anyone tried Apple? Heard from a buddy she's slim, wear spectacles with long hair, quite a pretty face despite early 30s. Likely to be Singaporean.

Will try soon to destress after work. :D

badboynani17
16-03-2012, 11:03 PM
Visited the joint a few days back. Was allocated Apple. :rolleyes:

Overall a nice and cosy place. The receptionist was a milf, with short hair but huge tits! Think she's the lady boss there! But I think she don't do massage. Well, I didn't ask anyway. Anyone knows if she does massage? Aiya, should have asked. Stupid me!

Apple came in and as expected, she was a petite lady wearing glasses. Looked innocent with the specs on, very Singaporean ah-lian but somehow or rather, it turned me on. Massage was ok, strength was good but not much conversation between us as I almost fell asleep cos the massage was great!

looks: 6.5/10
body: 7.5/10
boobs: b-cup
massage: 8.5/10 (strength)
ZG: 8.5/10
Damage: $46 (entrance fee) + $50
RTF: yes but maybe try others

Galiator
17-03-2012, 12:10 PM
Anyone tried Apple? Heard from a buddy she's slim, wear spectacles with long hair, quite a pretty face despite early 30s. Likely to be Singaporean.

Will try soon to destress after work. :D

Is Apple, the one from Quartermoon ?. now under reno for 2 weeks ?.

badboynani17
19-03-2012, 12:01 PM
bro, i have no idea where she was from. but she's quite a nice girl, smooth skin and have the CFM look with her spectacles on. Wow! THat's was a turn on! :D

Angon20
19-03-2012, 12:32 PM
Possible to share Yenny's contact and location? thanks

excelsior12345
19-03-2012, 12:52 PM
been hearing so much about yenny that i would like to try her massage. same request as Angon20 - possible to pm me the contact? thanks a mill.

MANS
19-03-2012, 03:51 PM
hi bro, can share the address

Bantuten
20-03-2012, 09:39 AM
In another thread they said this place and other spas close to this are are frequent raided by AV..... Do you have any FR's if this place is a hotspot?

Bantuten
20-03-2012, 09:46 AM
Is there any FR if this place is a hotspot for AV? Just checking the water first before swimming...



Visited the joint a few days back. Was allocated Apple. :rolleyes:

Overall a nice and cosy place. The receptionist was a milf, with short hair but huge tits! Think she's the lady boss there! But I think she don't do massage. Well, I didn't ask anyway. Anyone knows if she does massage? Aiya, should have asked. Stupid me!

Apple came in and as expected, she was a petite lady wearing glasses. Looked innocent with the specs on, very Singaporean ah-lian but somehow or rather, it turned me on. Massage was ok, strength was good but not much conversation between us as I almost fell asleep cos the massage was great!

looks: 6.5/10
body: 7.5/10
boobs: b-cup
massage: 8.5/10 (strength)
ZG: 8.5/10
Damage: $46 (entrance fee) + $50
RTF: yes but maybe try others

lihan1986
30-03-2012, 02:15 PM
Hi bro!
Pls share ctc n venue!
Thk!

hello2325
30-03-2012, 05:41 PM
Hi bro, can share contact and venue? Thanks!

moneymind
01-04-2012, 04:50 PM
Still open. Tried this today. The recept was fierce. Was shouting at a customer who walk all the way to the toilet. I think she thought was AV. Overheard asking this customer how old was he, he said 25. She told him to go somewhere because no offer sex here, must be. the young man left.

Have a MILF PRC, slim and massage skill was good. Step on my back and buttock told me that muscle too tense need to unblock. A bit pain but relaxing towards the end. Offer me JG $50 with autoroam clothes on. She wear safety pant. Noticed that their uniform was a black tee shirt and long, long skirt.

When time up, the recept shouted to the girl that time up...

RTM ? No.. the recept was hostile. the room has no privacy. No door and just a curtain where you cannot see from outside, but can see from inside. Did not managed to try any local or malaysia. can heard most of them are PRC.



quite a long while never been there...not too sure is still open.

Hitman
01-04-2012, 10:40 PM
Still open. Tried this today. The recept was fierce. Was shouting at a customer who walk all the way to the toilet. I think she thought was AV. Overheard asking this customer how old was he, he said 25. She told him to go somewhere because no offer sex here, must be. the young man left.

Have a MILF PRC, slim and massage skill was good. Step on my back and buttock told me that muscle too tense need to unblock. A bit pain but relaxing towards the end. Offer me JG $50 with autoroam clothes on. She wear safety pant. Noticed that their uniform was a black tee shirt and long, long skirt.

When time up, the recept shouted to the girl that time up...

RTM ? No.. the recept was hostile. the room has no privacy. No door and just a curtain where you cannot see from outside, but can see from inside. Did not managed to try any local or malaysia. can heard most of them are PRC.

Hoho... bro, I was there at that time too... ;)

I would return as I think all their masseurs do a good job with their massages, the recept not hostile lah... when she knows your face.

peking
04-06-2012, 08:01 PM
Bro ctc pls like it

kinghu
04-06-2012, 08:33 PM
bro, can share ctc, thk

peking
07-06-2012, 09:38 PM
Bro ctc pls like it

didnot hear from you ?

syt_syt
08-06-2012, 10:46 AM
Visited this place few weeks ago, upon reaching reception was ask to fill up name and ic number.
Soon, a lady looks not bad came and directed me to the room. No door type, just curtain.

Massage was quite good with occasionally her hand drifting towards your butt. Teasing you slowly. When flip over, GQ was not ask immediately. She will slowly massage your tight and occasionaly rubbing didi till he is fully grown up. Only den she will ask if you wanna go ahead. Too bad only HJ is on the menu. Standard rate $50. HJ was nice and slow, autoroam allow, her melons are quite big. Suck and suck till i cum. Clean me up with hot towel. Wiped me down slowly while we chatted.

Country of origin: PRC
Looks: 7/10
Boobs: C
Figure: 8/10
Massage: 8/10
HJ only $50
Massage: $56/hr
RTM: sure if the massage price is reduced.

Sammmysiao
08-06-2012, 12:14 PM
This Joint was temperary closed for renov...... and Reopening very soon.....;)

Looking00
08-06-2012, 07:29 PM
where?
where?
where?

oeioei
18-07-2012, 12:14 AM
Previously known as D'Oriental. Now changed name and reopened.
Recep area also changed.

Name: Apple.
Age: ~26
From: Suzhou
Looks: 7/10
Boobs: A+/B-
Figure: Slim
Height: ~1.60M
Massage: 8/10
HJ: 6.5/10

Damage: $36 for 30mins massage + $60 for HJ without roaming allowed (Kept insisting this is the current rate) or $70 for HJ with roaming and bra off.

Next time will try to nego to $50 when I return.

muncher
23-07-2012, 11:53 AM
Went back after it reopened. Same story-girl was pushing for BM n FJ, saying her boobs so big I'm not keen etc etc. Told me HJ was $60 n extras all can nego. When bargaining starts, I sianz already! WTF!

After she gave me a half hearted HJ, which I almost turned down, she tried to fish my pockets for more $$$! KNN!

Not so keen to repeat my visit there. Pity about the new management and girls. Unless Sammi is still there, probably won't step in again!

lixiao17
23-07-2012, 01:00 PM
Yah, I had the same experience, the place was closed for couple of months and now re-open, different management different gals.
This place used to be one of my favourite place and now it's not the same anymore, don't think i will be visiting this place again... :(