Tips/Tricks for Cheonging

[cashlove]

To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

2. When you do not know any gal in the HC, ask for your massage 1 or 2 hours later. Then sit in the lounge area to look that the chicks. See someone you like, ask her what her name. Then go recep to tell them you want this gal.

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

[LeeYokeYuen]

To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

2. When you do not know any gal in the HC, ask for your massage 1 or 2 hours later. Then sit in the lounge area to look that the chicks. See someone you like, ask her what her name. Then go recep to tell them you want this gal.

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

that's not very nice and that's not fair.

[Durkheim]

Tats not very fair to the ger even if her service sucks...imagine u are her and got short changed by a customer...sucks man u...

[evol 3]

1 tip from me, want come out to play, dont cheat the girls. Either you end up losing part of your memory, limbs, liagments or as many people believe you will suay for the rest of your life and it may come on at a later part of your life. how gigalos end up?

[HighLife]

To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

2. When you do not know any gal in the HC, ask for your massage 1 or 2 hours later. Then sit in the lounge area to look that the chicks. See someone you like, ask her what her name. Then go recep to tell them you want this gal.

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

Thanks for your precious tips. Unfortunately, they violate our cheongster code of conduct. No money No honey. As your nick suggest, love money then you have to forgo honey lor.

[waypastprime]

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

Mr Cashlove, are u a working personnel? Do u feel like working but not getting paid or at a lesser price agreed on? :rolleyes:

[sadfa]

bros,

please look at my thread: ktv girls who give you crap.

me and my bruddas have encountered many girls like that. the girl promised u this and that and give u crap service and after that want full payment and run off. how i feel like paying them lesser and not be such a big sucka.

how do u solve the problem from the cheongster view? and please dont ask who is the chabor hor!

[MachoDevilX]

Last week, I happened to see a PRC girl banging on the window of a car, in Joo Chiat along the roadside. The PRC girl is scolding the two guys siting in the car and the two guys just bochap her. Later more PRC girls came over shouting at the two guys and the two guys just drove off.

By any chance, is it you and your friend in the car, Cashlove? Keke.. :D

[toothbrush]

bros,

please look at my thread: ktv girls who give you crap.

me and my bruddas have encountered many girls like that. the girl promised u this and that and give u crap service and after that want full payment and run off. how i feel like paying them lesser and not be such a big sucka.

how do u solve the problem from the cheongster view? and please dont ask who is the chabor hor!

I think the most dun RTF lor...
sometime they give lousy service also Lan lan

[sadfa]

I think the most dun RTF lor...
sometime they give lousy service also Lan lan

becos they know we lan lan, so they continue doing it and treat us like suckas. mayb cashlove got a pt.

although i dont agree with shortchanging them if they do their job, but whether they do their job ok or well very subjective. some people think wu kang aisah liao, others may want more action.

[toothbrush]

becos they know we lan lan, so they continue doing it and treat us like suckas. mayb cashlove got a pt.

although i dont agree with shortchanging them if they do their job, but whether they do their job ok or well very subjective. some people think wu kang aisah liao, others may want more action.

One thing for sure they understimate the power of media....
If a bro happen to post the gal info...
she sure to lose alot of customer :D

[MachoDevilX]

becos they know we lan lan, so they continue doing it and treat us like suckas. mayb cashlove got a pt.

although i dont agree with shortchanging them if they do their job, but whether they do their job ok or well very subjective. some people think wu kang aisah liao, others may want more action.

I think it is case by case basis. If the girl complain this and that once inside the room, don't allow us to touch even her boobs, and keep on rushing for us to finish off, etc. then we should do something. Maybe complain to the OKT after that.

I still think it's not right to pay her only half after she completes the job. Since in the first place, it is agreed by both parties. And since the buyer agrees with the pricing, in moral right, he should be liable to pay her the full amount even if he is not satisfied. This is LL unless there are agreements that the buyer will only have to pay half if he is not satisfied with the girl. But I don't think any OKTs will have this gurantee since different guys may look for different criterias.
:cool:

[MachoDevilX]

One thing for sure they understimate the power of media....
If a bro happen to post the gal info...
she sure to lose alot of customer :D

Yup. That's the fantastic part of this forum that we are in. Any posts will affect the girl's business. Good FRs will boast up her business and bad one will make her catch flies.

:cool:

[Durkheim]

seems like bro cashlove has disappeared....

[intox75]

To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

2. When you do not know any gal in the HC, ask for your massage 1 or 2 hours later. Then sit in the lounge area to look that the chicks. See someone you like, ask her what her name. Then go recep to tell them you want this gal.

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

that's not very good... u should pay the amount that is agreed on even though her service sucks, just dun rtf. just like when u dine at the restuarant and the food or service sucks, just spread the news and dun ever return...

[owen10]

i agree with the general concensus of the bros here. pay wat u have promised d gal n not go bk on yr words; the most if her svc n attitude sucks, dun rtf; boycott her by all means, n feel free to warn d bros in this forum abt yr bad experience; u will be doin bros here a great svc n d bad publicity she gets will b gd enuff to punish her wrongdoings!

[hearthrob]

that's not very nice and that's not fair.

Bro, your comment is too kind to him...tat is not just not very nice and not fair....tat is extremely BAD....

[hearthrob]

i agree with the general concensus of the bros here. pay wat u have promised d gal n not go bk on yr words; the most if her svc n attitude sucks, dun rtf; boycott her by all means, n feel free to warn d bros in this forum abt yr bad experience; u will be doin bros here a great svc n d bad publicity she gets will b gd enuff to punish her wrongdoings!

Good comment! No one need to say more.

[Frankiestine]

[QUOTE=cashlove]To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

[UNQUOTE]

Truth but if you changed the gal and the next one they send it, you are expected to request for special services. After all that it what they would assume you would be unhappy about the gal, not chio enough for you to bang..so they normally send in a "better" one. If you didn't expect the "replacement" to curse and swear.....

[wanderer23]

To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

2. When you do not know any gal in the HC, ask for your massage 1 or 2 hours later. Then sit in the lounge area to look that the chicks. See someone you like, ask her what her name. Then go recep to tell them you want this gal.

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.


Trust you to start such a thread. I thought it's genuine tips for fellow bros here but you're just asking them to try to pay less for the service provided when it's provided fully to you. If you wanna pay less negotiate a price first then do the deal but not after then you try to wriggle out and pay less than what's agreed. That's very unethical of you

[MachoDevilX]

I think the intention of Cashlove is positive. It's just that the last part is not being agreed upon by most of the bros. For the first few tips that he has contribute, are quite well said. Just to be fair to him, I think we should give him some credit for it. If not, next time no bros will want to start sharing such information to newbies.

:cool:

[dettol]

To all brothers,
You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

I agree with points 1 & 2. But...
If u really so eh side outside, why resort to such low life methods? If I were a gangster, I will feel ashame to back u up and lastly - you are not fit to be a gangster head. And why so afraid to face the okt after u run from the hotel, get your gang to fight lah. KNN

If you buy a car that promisego from 0 to 100 km/h in 5 seconds and u took 10 seconds to reach that, are you going to get the car dealer to refund half the price you paid?

You have no integrity by backing out of a mutually agreed transaction. Shame on you!

[Ratcool69]

I think Cashlove is right for what he has said..I have done that twice..the girl promised everything but in the end only deliver about 10% of the service..damn angry..paid her half and told her to f*** off..she said called her okt..I said call..I call AV see who champion..the girl just left..

This type of girls need to be taught a lesson...if they go on cheating & taking advantage of us brothers...at our expense and pleasure (which we did not get!!)

[cashlove]

Good Morning Durkheim.

Hello to all brothers.

I will take all your comment, good and bad and all the flameing in a positive way. This is a free world and everyone is entitled to their point of view.

To Waypastprime, I am a working personnel. If my boss don't pay me, I go to MOM and there is a written employment contract. If I pay a gal half of the agreed price, she got no MOM, law, contract to protect her. Yes, I abuse it and the situation ALLOW IT.

Now, I cannot go Taka, take a good and tell the staff I am only paying half price or leave without paying. If I do that, security and police will come after me. I cannot go GL (legal brothel) for a fuck and not pay the full price even if service suck. This is because they are doing legal business.

But I can do that to HC and TN gal. The deal between me and the gal is a illegal one. That means there is not justice she can turn to.

someone ask me how do I think these gal feel. I got 2 thing to say

1. If your service suck, this is what you get.
2. You want to eat curry, dont complain it is spicy. You know you are in illegal trade, there will be situation like this.

Cheers

[cashlove]

To all brothers,

Thanks for all your comments. I will take it in a postive way.

[sToNeCoLd]

sToNeCoLd Verdict:

Thanks for your tips regards to the HC & most of our Samsters would have to go along with this suggestion of yours but about way you mentioned for the FL...sToNeCoLd does have second opinion and to agree to what most of our fella Samsters sentiments.

We do not want anyone to hold on to our neck after we have completed our job. In this case, legally you does have the bargaining upperhand but I guess you can only pull your stunt once..It is not fair for the FL even she does a sloppish or unsatisfying job to you or to us. However, gentlemanly and as a man..I believe we should just paid upon the price re-negotiated and ban her service from then onwards..The much more better way which I think is that, you can just post the FR for the benefits to all out fella Samsters here so that everyone is well informed about the her way below par standard or service and hencefore she will be blacklisted in Samsters cheong list..

[forex]

sToNeCoLd Verdict:

..can just post the FR for the benefits to all out fella Samsters here so that everyone is well informed about the her way below par standard or service and hencefore she will be blacklisted in Samsters cheong list..

with more camera phones around, we may even see the face or take note of any distinct feature.

[waypastprime]

Good Morning Durkheim.

Hello to all brothers.

I will take all your comment, good and bad and all the flameing in a positive way. This is a free world and everyone is entitled to their point of view.

To Waypastprime, I am a working personnel. If my boss don't pay me, I go to MOM and there is a written employment contract. If I pay a gal half of the agreed price, she got no MOM, law, contract to protect her. Yes, I abuse it and the situation ALLOW IT.

Cheers

Excellent! To the points stated in Red.

To each his own. I wont comment further on it. :)

P.S: I'm not the one who minus your reputation points. :o

[saint]

To those who dare to even try and back out of paying after being serviced in the joint, you think you may have gotten away with it....But just a word of advice, those girls have a long memory, some HCs have underworld connections and Singapore is a small country.

If one day they ever bum into you again, recognise and find out how to locate you (all they need is to find out where u work or which block of flat u r in), it's a simple matter for them to find some hired hands to maim or beat the living crap out of you.

So just pay them the promised sum and save yourself any future hospital bills. If you don't earn enough, plse don't go cheong HC or KTV, just go to GL and find a $40 Thai pros to settle your pleasure. Don't disgrace yourself and other S'pore men by your cheap and dishonourable actions.

Finally, do you all realize how many unsolved beating and missing person cases go by each month in this supposedly secure country? Don't live the rest of your life having to look over your shoulders all the time......

[forex]

good warning by siant. it is just not worth it, pay and forget, no money self service..if you are flexible, better still.

i must have been sleeping ..how come is fuck already then pay? if you know what i mean.

[evol 3]

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

Hello, the girl so stupid, let you fuck first than pay? Somemore got OKT to tutor.

[sadfa]

its one thing 2 b piss off over the actions of these chabor, its another 2 take advantage knowing they lan lan cannot do anything to u.

yes they are doing something illegal and cant report u 2 police, but there are other ways of getting back at u, even if not, y do such a chek ak thing to them? if u so eh sai, do u borrow money from ah long and dont pay back? do u bet with illegal bookie and dont pay when lose?

many chabor do this cos they got their own sob story. dont add 2 it but dont b a sucka 2!

[mccormick]

that cashlove sibeh loser leh... song song liao then pay half price.... anyway, there are always such ppl around us... its a matter of time they will learn their lesson... No money, no cheong..

As far as I know, most WL are very professional... once agreed on the price and they will make sure you cum, even if its gonna take longer time... Unless u tell them to stop and end the session... For this, I personally encountered b4.. not only once..

[sadfa]

that cashlove sibeh loser leh... song song liao then pay half price.... anyway, there are always such ppl around us... its a matter of time they will learn their lesson... No money, no cheong..

As far as I know, most WL are very professional... once agreed on the price and they will make sure you cum, even if its gonna take longer time... Unless u tell them to stop and end the session... For this, I personally encountered b4.. not only once..

song song liao of course must pay full price.
if u cannot cum, also must pay full price.
but if u cannot cum cos the charbor chut pattern until u got no mood or cannot cum, also pay full price meh?

[MonsterX]

To all brothers,

I offer some tip on going HC, TN outlets and FL. Perhaps other brothers can share and comment.

For HC
1. Do you know that when the management assign a girl for you, the first girl you can reject? This is a unwritten norm in most HC.

2. When you do not know any gal in the HC, ask for your massage 1 or 2 hours later. Then sit in the lounge area to look that the chicks. See someone you like, ask her what her name. Then go recep to tell them you want this gal.

For HC, FL and TN,

You can try or do the following ONLY if you are very BOLD, very A-sai outside, know gangsters or you are a gangster head yourself or very kuai lan.

You agreed on a price say $50 for HJ. She did a lousy job, attitude suck etc...

Get dressed, wear your shoe, take your belonging be in a position to leave the joint. Then pay her $20. She argue, simply tell her her service suck, $20 is what she get. If she still make noise, say to her "You unhappy is it? Call police lah" Then you walk out. You see they are doing a illegal business and the is no law to protect them. If managment help her and thing start to get physcial, say " If you dare to touch me, you can rest assured AV will visit your shop."

I personally had fuck a FL pay her $100 instead of $200. She try to stop me from leaving the room but she is too weak. I did not take the lift down, I took the stairs. I reckon they may have their own people in the lobby. The moment I step out of the Hotel, OKT called me "Where are you now?" Only a fool will tell her.

Fyi... bro cashlove,as those a-sai gangster or head of gangster who reli strong....WILL NV DO THAT TO A GAL WHO IS WORKING HARD WIF HER BODY TO MAKE A LIVING!!!!!! Wat they will do is...juz pay the amount they promise...complaint to okt of lousy service...if buai song...juz hamtan the okt along wif their bouncers or so....,me not a gangster head or a-sai....but if i buai song wif the service..i can always confornt them and if okt dare to call me...knn juz whack them or end up being whack depend on who is stronger...but nv play a bastard to cheat a pity gal lidat.......NO STANDARD!!_|_

[fun4evergood]

Fyi... bro cashlove,as those a-sai gangster or head of gangster who reli strong....WILL NV DO THAT TO A GAL WHO IS WORKING HARD WIF HER BODY TO MAKE A LIVING!!!!!! Wat they will do is...juz pay the amount they promise...complaint to okt of lousy service...if buai song...juz hamtan the okt along wif their bouncers or so....,me not a gangster head or a-sai....but if i buai song wif the service..i can always confornt them and if okt dare to call me...knn juz whack them or end up being whack depend on who is stronger...but nv play a bastard to cheat a pity gal lidat.......NO STANDARD!!_|_

Well Said !! :D

[snowowlf79]

Fyi... bro cashlove,as those a-sai gangster or head of gangster who reli strong....WILL NV DO THAT TO A GAL WHO IS WORKING HARD WIF HER BODY
i agree to what to say. but the reason why must we pay the full price for a half-f*** job done. in this case, shouldnt we be paying the same rate too ?? ie half-f*** job pay half price etc.??

[newyorker88]

To cashlove bro,
Cheongster code of conduct: Be a man and pay upon what was agreed upon. Bad service? Do one time business and never return. Afterall, this is a free world where we can advertise for them in this forum also.

We can always black list them in this forum, and those brothers agree will add on with their experience. Pretty soon, that shop or gal will lose a lot of customers.

There was once a guy who ask AV to raid that tui na shop! Of course those who remember will know which one I am refering to.

Gals working to sell their bodies do it becos of $$$. All men have their needs as well, but BEING a man, I live up to wat I promise, and pay them the $$$. Afterall, it may not be a nice experience, but still u get what you want, be it a FJ or HJ or BBBJ, or watever.

It is like eating a plate of chicken rice, you eat it already and tell the stall keeper that you want a refund?

Of course, we are all working personal, and we have MOM laws protecting us. But think of those on contract and the company wind up? And go bankrupt... MOM able to get the $$$ back for them?

End of the day, wat goes around comes around. It may be illegal for them to do such services, but everyone does something so that they get to eat.

I hope u can change your mind abt not paying them the full sum.

Good day!

[MonsterX]

i agree to what to say. but the reason why must we pay the full price for a half-f*** job done. in this case, shouldnt we be paying the same rate too ?? ie half-f*** job pay half price etc.??

In that case...as i had mentioned,u can confornt or complaint to her okt or company...and reason out wif them...if they deny ur complaint..that is the time to show them we dun pay money to be bullied..but we dun play a bully to a gal too.....that is no standard.!!...no money dun cheong....dun act like a stupid fucker like tread starter still think u smart to do dat kind of thing..and haf the cheek to tell everyone here...disgrace all samsters....knn!!_|_ :mad:

[Emperor KangXi]

To all Bros out there,

When Cheonging, we need to actually use our 7th sense (the sex sense) and make the ideal choice. Of course la, this comes with experience.

But we think we made the right choice and they only perform to 50% of our standards, then be fair and pay loh.

The Char Boh's also people right? They also need to survive what. If we feel that not worth the money, just take it as buying a experience.

Cheonging is about fun so dun like things mentioned in all the replies dampen our cheonging spirit. :cool: