Divorce and separation questions on HDB

[momogaga]

Hi bros
wondering if any bros out there care to enlighten and share some mechanics and legal of the above topics.

1. Pertaining to a new HDB how would this be handled?
2. Will divorce based on grounds of adultery affect my chances of getting a fair distribution of the asset?
3. What are my chances of retaining the asset if I am a PR? I have been a PR for 10 years.

I know there are something written on relevant sources but I thought I would hear from bros who have been there and emphatize with my situation.

[porscheclub]

Your divorce lawyer & HDB will be able to answer you better.

For HDB flat, it must be sold & remaining funds be divided among both parties. I'm not sure if you can find another name to do a joint ownership but then you must settle the loan & pay her. CPF if any is the first creditor to repay.

In short, no point getting sentimental over a property.

[momogaga]

Your divorce lawyer & HDB will be able to answer you better.

For HDB flat, it must be sold & remaining funds be divided among both parties. I'm not sure if you can find another name to do a joint ownership but then you must settle the loan & pay her. CPF if any is the first creditor to repay.

In short, no point getting sentimental over a property.

Not sentimental at all. Just trying to find out if there's any way to do it such that I am positioned more favourably... gain eligibility to own the apartment or reduce my financial loses if I cannot do that.

[porscheclub]

Not sentimental at all. Just trying to find out if there's any way to do it such that I am positioned more favourably... gain eligibility to own the apartment or reduce my financial loses if I cannot do that.

Anyway, both of you have to go court & swear to transparency on your assets.

Best is to sit down & discuss with your wife how to split everything in harmony. Otherwise, it's a very messy & long drawn battle easily stretching to 3yrs costing over S$50K lawyer fees.

[Xyberduke]

Hi bros
wondering if any bros out there care to enlighten and share some mechanics and legal of the above topics.

1. Pertaining to a new HDB how would this be handled?
2. Will divorce based on grounds of adultery affect my chances of getting a fair distribution of the asset?
3. What are my chances of retaining the asset if I am a PR? I have been a PR for 10 years.

I know there are something written on relevant sources but I thought I would hear from bros who have been there and emphatize with my situation.

Clear your mind and write down what you want to know again.... the questions you posted are very vague.

1. Question is open-ended. What exactly is your HDB status and what do you want to know. You may be glad to learn that most HDB question can be sent directly through their feedback and you will receive an official reply.

2. Yes it will affect.

3. Open-ended again. What asset? If your PR status is mainly achieve through your marriage to a Singaporean, you should start thinking about how to renew it.

[4getful]

Hi bros
wondering if any bros out there care to enlighten and share some mechanics and legal of the above topics.

1. Pertaining to a new HDB how would this be handled?
2. Will divorce based on grounds of adultery affect my chances of distribution of the asset?
3. What are my chances of retaining the asset if I am a PR? I have been a PR for 10 years.

I know there are something written on relevant sources but I thought I would hear from bros who have been there and emphatize with my situation.

From what i see and i understand nowadays, divorce is very common. So, should settle it fast and continue your new love life with another lady. When you sign the piece of marriage cert, there is a reason for the word women charter printed there. Some might called it the male slavery deed.

1. if new house less than 5years MOP, you cannot sell. Either you keep it with another single or return back to HDB. Can check with their webpage for clearer info.

2. adultery should be the faster way to get divorce. Adultery does not mean anything as more n more ppl are having sex before marriage. Chastity issue will not make you lose out anything but women charter will.

3. asset as in the flat? Refer to 1.

As marriage falls in wc, be prepared to be in poverty till she dies or else face jail sentence. ;)

[Triple70]

1. if new house less than 5years MOP, you cannot sell. Either you keep it with another single or return back to HDB.


I heard a rumour.. the latest policy is.. if flat still under MOP, divorce will not be granted. Something about discouraging divorce?

Anyone have any concrete experience with this topic?

[Ngengheng]

I heard a rumour.. the latest policy is.. if flat still under MOP, divorce will not be granted. Something about discouraging divorce?

Anyone have any concrete experience with this topic?

Never heard before.....divorce is something personal have nothing to do with HDB...

[ShittyAss]

I heard a rumour.. the latest policy is.. if flat still under MOP, divorce will not be granted. Something about discouraging divorce?

Anyone have any concrete experience with this topic?

Divorce will still be granted. U need court order to send to hbd to appeal for them to allow u to sell your Hdb if it's within mop.

[ShittyAss]

1. Pertaining to a new HDB how would this be handled?
>> new hbd meaning BTO? N I suppose I staying in already? It's the same as any Hdb flat. If above 35yrs old then u can buy it over under single scheme. Discuss with your wife who want to take over the flat

2. Will divorce based on grounds of adultery affect my chances of getting a fair distribution of the asset?
>> u commit adultery? It's your monthly maintainence that u need your wife to agree as well. Your other assets cash property etc... Discuss with your wife if not very messy n draggy...
U got any kids? Prepare to lose the custody if kids v young..

3. What are my chances of retaining the asset if I am a PR? I have been a PR for 10 years.
>> it doesn't affect whether u are PR or not leh

[4getful]

I heard a rumour.. the latest policy is.. if flat still under MOP, divorce will not be granted. Something about discouraging divorce?

Anyone have any concrete experience with this topic?

I think that is rumour only. they cannot use a flat to tie two unhappy person tgt one.. New rule is that couple need to undergo counselling session when they apply to be divorce.same as they dished out mandatory counselling session for men marrying foreign women. With strengthening of the wc, they are wondering why fewer ppl wanted babies and less intended to get married. So these rule are to help lesser divorce. But you think they really do not know? Maybe all these new rule will further escalate divorce as more ppl remain single. :rolleyes:

[damong777]

Hi bros
wondering if any bros out there care to enlighten and share some mechanics and legal of the above topics.

1. Pertaining to a new HDB how would this be handled?
2. Will divorce based on grounds of adultery affect my chances of getting a fair distribution of the asset?
3. What are my chances of retaining the asset if I am a PR? I have been a PR for 10 years.

I know there are something written on relevant sources but I thought I would hear from bros who have been there and emphatize with my situation.

1) you need to write into HDB to ask. I got a answer on my query within 3 working days.
2) Adultery on your part then you are going to lose big time. Women chapter is leaning on woman. This would affect in terms of HDB flat and shared assets plus maintenance.

Question you should ask or find out more about
a) How much directly you and your spouse is contributing
b) Court would take into consideration indirect contribution
c) What is under yours will be your and what is under her hers. Unless it is shared or joint accounts; then you need to justify contribution level to accounts
d) Here is the killer - r you going to pay your wife a lump sum or monthly maintenance? If you got kids, even worse.
If possible, go for lump sum settlement
Reasons are you are going to pay till your wife get married or died and failure to pay maintenance can result in jail terms. Kids to paid up to 21 yrs. Sorry if you remarried, you are still eligible to pay maintenance. And never take the $1 token sum settlement. She can always for revision.
e) Are your going to take over the flat or going to sell it off?

3) Honestly if you are a PR, more than 36 and 5 years of MOP, take over the flat if you can. Otherwise, you have a difficult time buying a flat as grants for PR are next to nothing now.

4) Find a good lawyer specializing in family law. Though initial fees may be higher, but u save in the long term

5) And if divorce is last option, ensure you keep all Ur receipts; go drinking or hotel pay by cash.

And dun ask me why i know so much....

[4getful]

Always have this curiosity when ppl say adultery. Is it caught red handed, the hubby told her or just based on guessing? I mean can always denied. Exchanging of sms or email is not a strong proof to convince one has sex with a woman. Smart women need more proof than these, unless the woman is already sick of the marriage, way before the incident happen.:rolleyes: but with the enhance in wc, i guess more women are more willing to initiate a divorce proceesing.;)

[jtng]

Men have pride. So do women. I'll try to give perspective from a guy's POV:

You ask him to quit job because of long hours etc. He might interpret it as "你看不起我”。 My experience is when people stop talking is because one party choose not to talk. A successful marriage requires both parties to support each other. Pick a good time when he is not tired/falling asleep/just come back from work: Those are the WORST times to talk about heart matters, esp for guy. If I come home super shag first thing I want is to sleep, not to make conversation. It might sound selfish, but we are only human. Shag? Sleep lo. Try talking when he is awake. Be patient and wait for it. I believe every marriage is worth salvaging because of the times spent together in the past.

One absolute NO NO is to ask his side of the family to convey your feelings to him. Maybe a tactful way is for your parents to casually ask about the marriage when you all meetup?

Just my 2cents hope it helps. Keep us updated.

[momogaga]

Thanks bros for reply on this thread. I know many questions I need to answer but I've been very tired and taking a break from all these and just be alone with myaelf most time.

I am surprised to know from damong that a PR can take over the HDB if above 36 years old ? I thought HDB is meant for citizen only. With policy every so protective and biased towards citizens.

I was caught with infidelity with photos which have since been deleted. For info. Take care bros.

[momogaga]

Also, I am just in my first year of MOP. Could I do separatuon for 3-4 years and drag the divorce until after MOP so I can sell on open market or takeover.

[Xyberduke]

Also, I am just in my first year of MOP. Could I do separatuon for 3-4 years and drag the divorce until after MOP so I can sell on open market or takeover.

for the house, yes.

[Triple70]

I am surprised to know from damong that a PR can take over the HDB if above 36 years old ? I thought HDB is meant for citizen only. With policy every so protective and biased towards citizens.



I believe damong may be incorrect.
Under the 35 and above scheme, it's only meant for single citizen.

The Public scheme that PRs normally purchase HDB flats.. must include another PR or citizen.

http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyResaleFlatEligibilitytobuy?OpenDocument

[4getful]

I believe damong may be incorrect.
Under the 35 and above scheme, it's only meant for single citizen.

The Public scheme that PRs normally purchase HDB flats.. must include another PR or citizen.

http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyResaleFlatEligibilitytobuy?OpenDocument

Oh i am surprise to know two pr can purchase a hdb flat. Hdb flat is for citizen only, it should be at least 1 pr n 1 citizen, so surprise to learn that. As for those local single men who already own a hdb flat, n decided to marry a foreign woman. If so unfortunately they died, their flat will goes to the foreign bride. Even the parents or sister bro staying tgt with him will be chase out and the foreign bride can sell it and took all his cpf n hse money. Unless the decease make a nomination before he died. Got such thing?

TS, your divorce lawyer can advise you on any questions you have regarding the divorce or seperation. They r professional n their info are more up to date.

[Triple70]

Oh i am surprise to know two pr can purchase a hdb flat. Hdb flat is for citizen only, it should be at least 1 pr n 1 citizen, so surprise to learn that. As for those local single men who already own a hdb flat, n decided to marry a foreign woman. If so unfortunately they died, their flat will goes to the foreign bride. Even the parents or sister bro staying tgt with him will be chase out and the foreign bride can sell it and took all his cpf n hse money. Unless the decease make a nomination before he died. Got such thing?

The govt belief is that resale flats are no longer considered subsidised flats. Any subsidies is through CPF or other form of grants which are strictly for citizens only. Let's be fair, PRs do need a place to stay, and not all are the rich types.

As for the happy sg guy who marries a foreign bride.. it's his flat, and his decision who to give it to. Parents.. siblings.. just because they are sg citizens.. dun mean they shd get the flat. Freedom of choice for the guy to decide. I can clearly understand why foreign brides are so alluring. The push factor is substantial.

[MoJoe313]

As for those local single men who already own a hdb flat, n decided to marry a foreign woman. If so unfortunately they died, their flat will goes to the foreign bride. Even the parents or sister bro staying tgt with him will be chase out and the foreign bride can sell it and took all his cpf n hse money. Unless the decease make a nomination before he died. Got such thing?


The nomination is a simple format of a Will. Should anyone pass on, in the absence of a Will, the rules of Intestacy applies. His assets will all go to his spouse. If the deceased has kids, the spouse gets 50% of all assets while the remaining 50% is divided equally between his children. If no wife and kids, then it goes to parents and siblings. So in your example, if he owns the apartment and his foreign wife can prove the marriage, she gets all his assets. Cpf and apartment is part of the list of assets.

To avoid such a scenario, get a Will done. It won't cost much. I did mine for $100+. You can dictate who you want to give your assets to and in what proportion. Protects the dependents. The executors of your estate can bypass a lot of lengthy process that a Intestate case has to go through.

[MoJoe313]

If I am not wrong, one can nominate for CPF only. Don't think there is such thing as nominate for flat. Must use a Will to do that.

And if I am not wrong, the nomination must be done AFTER he marries. If done before he marries, his marriage nulls his nomination. If no nomination is re-done, it goes Intestate.

[MoJoe313]

Hi bros
wondering if any bros out there care to enlighten and share some mechanics and legal of the above topics.

1. Pertaining to a new HDB how would this be handled?
2. Will divorce based on grounds of adultery affect my chances of getting a fair distribution of the asset?
3. What are my chances of retaining the asset if I am a PR? I have been a PR for 10 years.

I know there are something written on relevant sources but I thought I would hear from bros who have been there and emphatize with my situation.


1. When you get your Decree Absolute, you can apply to HDB with it to dispose of your HDB if it falls inside the minimum stay period. Don't expect your Decree Absolute to come so fast. It can take years.

2. Nope. Adultery is just used to determine inability to live together. The division of assets takes a lot into consideration, including each's contribution. You can assume it to be 50/50. She may get maintenance in addition to her 50% if she can prove she has no income and is fully dependent on you.

One trick the woman's lawyer usually use is to ask for $1. Do not agree to it if you can. She can vary it upwards later. You don't want to have a high income during this process. I got a friend who purposely took on a lower paying job to avoid maintenance. When it was over, he quietly got back a job that paid him well.

3. Law is blind to whether you are PR or otherwise.

Hope you don't have kids. It gets a lot more complicated.

[MoJoe313]

Also, I am just in my first year of MOP. Could I do separatuon for 3-4 years and drag the divorce until after MOP so I can sell on open market or takeover.

Bro,
I think you are very confused. Your divorce and HDB are 2 separate matters. You can separate, drag or don't drag or drag during the divorce proceedings etc. It doesnt affect your HDB. Only upon application do you need a family nucleus. After possessing it, its yours. Your family nucleus disintegrates, HDB can't take it back. (Imagine if one spouse dies, HDB cant ask for it back). If you want to dispose it before MOP, just write in.

[damong777]

Always have this curiosity when ppl say adultery. Is it caught red handed, the hubby told her or just based on guessing? I mean can always denied. Exchanging of sms or email is not a strong proof to convince one has sex with a woman. Smart women need more proof than these, unless the woman is already sick of the marriage, way before the incident happen.:rolleyes: but with the enhance in wc, i guess more women are more willing to initiate a divorce proceesing.;)

Must be caught red handed. Confession by spouse in written or in front of witness acceptable.

[damong777]

I believe damong may be incorrect.
Under the 35 and above scheme, it's only meant for single citizen.

The Public scheme that PRs normally purchase HDB flats.. must include another PR or citizen.

http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyResaleFlatEligibilitytobuy?OpenDocument

I do agree I may be wrong. That why best write in to hdb to ask. Got a response within 3 working days

[damong777]

1. When you get your Decree Absolute, you can apply to HDB with it to dispose of your HDB if it falls inside the minimum stay period. Don't expect your Decree Absolute to come so fast. It can take years.

2. Nope. Adultery is just used to determine inability to live together. The division of assets takes a lot into consideration, including each's contribution. You can assume it to be 50/50. She may get maintenance in addition to her 50% if she can prove she has no income and is fully dependent on you.

One trick the woman's lawyer usually use is to ask for $1. Do not agree to it if you can. She can vary it upwards later. You don't want to have a high income during this process. I got a friend who purposely took on a lower paying job to avoid maintenance. When it was over, he quietly got back a job that paid him well.

3. Law is blind to whether you are PR or otherwise.

Hope you don't have kids. It gets a lot more complicated.

Be careful w point 2. If the spouse is smart enough to find out, she can ask for review or sue the man for false declaration of intent...no fun.

[VaeVictus]

What about:

Inheriting HDB from parents.
Parents pass away and owner of Flat is just me.
If I get married and we end up in divorce, will she be entitled to half of the flat when my parents paid in full for the HDB years ago?
Will i need to sell the flat during the divorce?

[MoJoe313]

If you can prove you inherited the flat fully, with no loans, it will not form part of the matrimonial assets.

You don't have to sell when you divorce. Its yours.

The test is what you 2 accumulated DURING marriage.

[MoJoe313]

Be careful w point 2. If the spouse is smart enough to find out, she can ask for review or sue the man for false declaration of intent...no fun.

Yea, thats what the $1 does. She can vary it upwards long after the divorce, meaning she need not find a job, fucks another man and get you to pay her bills. No fun indeed.

[damong777]

Yea, thats what the $1 does. She can vary it upwards long after the divorce, meaning she need not find a job, fucks another man and get you to pay her bills. No fun indeed.

Yup...maintenance payable up to when she or u die or when she get remarry.

Important notice is she get remarry then u dun pay...u remarry still pay.

So must settle one lump sum if can

[VaeVictus]

If you can prove you inherited the flat fully, with no loans, it will not form part of the matrimonial assets.

You don't have to sell when you divorce. Its yours.

The test is what you 2 accumulated DURING marriage.

Thanks Bro.. What happens if I sell my HDB, use part of the money for another HDB and also use the extras for a Condo? What will happen during the divorce? Does that mean I'll lose out both since I'm basically using whatever I inherited to pay for the new homes?

[MoJoe313]

Waaa.....so complicated. I fear giving advice. You should check actual with a lawyer.

I am guessing if you used your inheritance to pay say 30% percentage of each hdb and condo, and both got mortgage repayments that serviced by you 2 during marriage, then it will be apportioned like 30% yours + (70%/2) if you can prove the inheritance money trail.

[VaeVictus]

Waaa.....so complicated. I fear giving advice. You should check actual with a lawyer.

I am guessing if you used your inheritance to pay say 30% percentage of each hdb and condo, and both got mortgage repayments that serviced by you 2 during marriage, then it will be apportioned like 30% yours + (70%/2) if you can prove the inheritance money trail.

Thanks MoJoe313 =P

I'm just asking out of curiousity. I've seen too many of my friends go through divorce that I myself am fearful of going through. What they've gotten, earned and achieved over the years, Gone after the divorce. Some still retain their previous possessions. I'm just asking cause I don't want my surviving parent to be left without a home (he's a foreigner) or having to deal with anything else.

Thanks again.

[damong777]

Thanks MoJoe313 =P

I'm just asking out of curiousity. I've seen too many of my friends go through divorce that I myself am fearful of going through. What they've gotten, earned and achieved over the years, Gone after the divorce. Some still retain their previous possessions. I'm just asking cause I don't want my surviving parent to be left without a home (he's a foreigner) or having to deal with anything else.

Thanks again.

If he can take citizenship or have investment over $3Million, transfer property to his name.

Similarly, during divorce proceeding, is up to mutual parties to prove assets. Some of items can be nego or be up to court judgement esp if the guy kena caught in act of adultery and the wife is a house wife...that is a sure lose case and prepared to pay over the nose.

Most impt get a very good lawyer and if possible can a mutual agreement on divorce. this would save time and lawyer fee.