Betrayed

[Indigoflashed]

Took me a long while before I decided to seek some advice here.

I’m male, local, married 3 years to a girl that I have known for 11 years.

About a year ago my wife’s behavior started to change. She started to dress up a lot more, started clubbing and I could also sense her becoming more protective about her cell phone. I didn’t give it much thought initially, as I trusted her wholeheartedly and didn’t imagine she would have an affair, but turns out that I should have listened to my guts much earlier.

So I decided to surprise her one day when she said she was working late, went to pick her up from her office. I waited for a long time before I decided to call and she told me she was still working. I sensed something amiss, so I did something I never normally do, tracked her using find my iPhone.

Turns out that she was somewhere nearby, in the middle of a park, not working in office as she said. I proceeded to the location and discovered her making out with another man. My heart sank. I confronted them, and since then I have been on a torturous mental journey.

I asked her all kinds of questions, how long she has been seeing him, how did it happen, did you have sex etc and after heavy questioning she confessed that she had been seeing him for a month, did not have sex, and had been making out only on several occasions. I could not believe it one bit, as she appeared very defensive and only after my heavy interrogation did she reveal more details.

I could not believe my partner of 11 years could be capable of something like this, and I could not believe that it was simply “making out”. Her explanation was sketchy at best and very very brief, so I’m not sure what to think.

What do you all think?

[Indigoflashed]

When I found out about the affair I pretty much became someone totally opposite of who I was

I wanted to work things out, but she would always retreat and do not want to talk, on the reason that she is scared of antagonizing me further and do not want to hurt me further.

I became super paranoid, so much so that I would follow her just to see if she was lying to me. I checked her phone, something I never used to do before. When she learnt about these she changed her passwords, and stopped me basically from snooping on her privacy. Why do all that if she has nothing to hide? I also found her saving the guys number under a different name a week after I deleted the guys number. When I confronted her she said she forgot to delete as she contacted him to end things.

I became temperamental. All these years I worked hard to pay for our future. I paid for her education, the car, the house, the renovation, most of our outings, and I never asked her to do a job against her wishes. She practically didn’t have to worry about anything financially. When this happened I became extremely unbalanced, unbalanced that she took all these for granted and sought comfort in another man.

I became cold and unpredictable. Before this I could do anything for her. I always spent time with her, listened to her issues at work, and even go pick her up often when she works late even though I’m exhausted myself. It wasn’t exactly a short drive, 30 mins one way. When this happened I just couldn’t help but she betrayed me and destroyed everything we built, or rather I built for he last decade or so.

All that being said I still love her. I want it to work, but I’m afraid of getting hurt again. I want to believe her, but she is making it so difficult by constantly changing her passwords and denying me the chance to validate her words. I want her to go back to who she was before, but at the same time I am concerned she will feel restrained and cheat again. I want to be myself again, but all these thoughts and all these loose ends just keeps resurfacing and my ugly side comes back out.

What can I do?

[I Love Boobs]

Been there before.
She still wants to continue the fling with this guy.
Leave her.
Sounds like you have a significant age gap (as you're sponsoring her education previously).
Most likely the new guy is younger and fitter looking...
End the traumatic relationship. But be prepared to lose a lot in the divorce settlement....

[sammyboyfor]

I'll be perfectly blunt. She does not love you anymore so it is time to move on.

If she still loved you she would be putting a lot of effort into making amends after being caught.

Being paranoid and constantly checking on her is not going to help matters. If she has the hots for some other guy trying to prevent them from meeting or communicating will only make matters worse.

It's a sad state of affairs but it is very common for relationships to end up this way. It has nothing to do with how you have treated her.

I have come across girls that have treated their guy like shit despite the fact that he treats her like a princess.

Conversely I have known girls to be crazy over a guy who treats them very badly.

Logic does not apply when it comes to matters of the heart.

[subidowa]

That is why I am reluctant to get married even though I am more than comfortable to get married. Never trust anyone, especially woman and the more dangerous the prettier they are (advice from ZHANG WU JI's mum). It is human nature to betray. Hard to find one that doesn't. It definitely feel painful to be hurt by the one whom ur hand been feeding all this while.

For the sake of the bros here. Please advise after getting divorced( In the worst situation), how much she will take from ur fortunes (housing, money and children etc) even though u have proof of her betrayal. Even though she is the one being wrong, once women chapter steps in, we guys will still be in the losing end right? Better if you can get advise from ur lawyer what are the necessary papers to be signed before marriage to protect our own interests. It is even more sucky to be hurt and yet still have to pay for getting rid of this kind of pest. Please help to advise, we can learn from you. Not say I totally don't want to give some to the wife (if have), I would split evenly whatever we have bought after marriage but wanna keep those I originally have before marriage only.

[I Love Boobs]

On average I'm paying about S$4000 per month for spouse support, property repayments (yup, she got the house) and children's education, tuition etc.
Am renting a room now and have to work overtime...

[fallen11]

such stories pretty common nowadays.
whatever the price, your best outcome is to end this relationship / marriage.
After that, can start your life anew.
1 to 2 yrs later, U'll be glad u took that step to end it.
Yes will lose a lot in divorce. Minimise the loss, gather evidence of her adultery activities. Submit these in court, make judge more sympathetic to u, make u pay less.
After that just move on with your life. :)

Maybe u still love her and wanna savage this.
But it will never be the same again.

And i dont believe she hasnt had any sex with other guy/guys too.
Try having sex with her and see her mood. Probably she wont even agree to do it with u ever again.

[subidowa]

On average I'm paying about S$4000 per month for spouse support, property repayments (yup, she got the house) and children's education, tuition etc.
Am renting a room now and have to work overtime...


Are u in the wrong? U got caught cheating???? If u are in the wrong, then I have no comments la. TS situation is quite different. If you are in the same situation, holy shit, i'm not getting married. I only going to have incubated children only. IN sinapore, divorce is too unfair to us guys.

[sammyboyfor]

On average I'm paying about S$4000 per month for spouse support, property repayments (yup, she got the house) and children's education, tuition etc.
Am renting a room now and have to work overtime...

I honestly think that commercial sex is the way to go. It's cheaper, more enjoyable and offers far more variety.

For example instead of trying to persuade a wife to have a threesome all you need to do is book two girls for a tarma session.

If you want anal sex offer the right girl enough money and your wishes are granted.

The $4000 per month could you buying you $400 high quality fucks 10 times a month which is more than twice per week. This is far more sex than most people get from their wives after a few years of marriage.

The best part of the deal is you don't have to fuck the same girl 10 times a month you can have a fresh new face on a regular basis.

Once in a while you can treat yourself to a high quality $2000 fuck and you'll still be saving money compared to what a marriage costs.

[I Love Boobs]

I honestly think that commercial sex is the way to go. It's cheaper, more enjoyable and offers far more variety.

For example instead of trying to persuade a wife to have a threesome all you need to do is book two girls for a tarma session.

If you want anal sex offer the right girl enough money and your wishes are granted.

The $4000 per month could you buying you $400 high quality fucks 10 times a month which is more than twice per week. This is far more sex than most people get from their wives after a few years of marriage.

The best part of the deal is you don't have to fuck the same girl 10 times a month you can have a fresh new face on a regular basis.

Once in a while you can treat yourself to a high quality $2000 fuck and you'll still be saving money compared to what a marriage costs.

In this twisted world unfortunately that logic is correct...
The loneliness is biting though...
But what price companionship? Perhaps a price too high for most men to bear.

[I Love Boobs]

Are u in the wrong? U got caught cheating???? If u are in the wrong, then I have no comments la. TS situation is quite different. If you are in the same situation, holy shit, i'm not getting married. I only going to have incubated children only. IN sinapore, divorce is too unfair to us guys.

I'm no saint and I've had ONS and paid for FLs.
Went slow after marriage....
Never a long-term affair though.
And I was never caught cheating.
Was chased out of the house by the ex-wife who collaborated with her parents.
Telling me that I was useless and that my job as a photographer was worthless and that I had no real qualifications.....
This to hide the affair.
I was working overtime to meet ends meet and working weekends.
She was going out for fucks at 5 star hotels with the old man while her mum took care of the kids.
Hell, they even invited the old man over for dinner at home while I was away at work.....

And evidence means jackshit in court.
I had a friend who hired a PI who caught her ex-husband and his mistress hugging and holding hands. And entering a hotel room together.
She submitted the evidence in court and it was thrown out for not showing intimacy and being obtained through illegal means...

[sammyboyfor]

In this twisted world unfortunately that logic is correct...
The loneliness is biting though...
But what price companionship? Perhaps a price too high for most men to bear.

The problem is that finding companionship in a wife is the exception rather than the norm.

Men have to take part of the blame for this because they choose the girl that is the most attractive and the best fuck at the time rather than someone that they could bond with on a more spiritual level.

In order for a marriage to work a wife has to be best friend first and foremost. Sex should be secondary. This is because friendship based upon common interests and value systems will far outlast the sexual part of the relationship.

[I Love Boobs]

The problem is that finding companionship in a wife is the exception rather than the norm.

Men have to take part of the blame for this because they choose the girl that is the most attractive and the best fuck at the time rather than someone that they could bond with on a more spiritual level.

In order for a marriage to work a wife has to be best friend first and foremost. Sex should be secondary. This is because friendship based upon common interests and value systems will far outlast the sexual part of the relationship.

That is highly idealistic.
It takes years to really know a person.
I didn't know what my wife was for sure.
I'm sure TS will also question who's behind that Brilliant Disguise.
To quote Bruce Springsteen...

[Indigoflashed]

I would like to present her side to the story.

She said she felt bored/distracted, and has since professed that she was wrong. Since the incident, while she has been changing passwords etc, I admit that I have given her a very hard time and severely invaded her privacy by following her, trying to install spyware (but failed) and also doubted what she told me by asking her to show me evidence of where and who she is with (pictures etc)

She said that me being like this is causing her pain and is driving her away, and I know that for a fact, she has been more of an escapist all these years.

The guy isn’t even handsome, in fact, I’m way better looking, fit, and only slightly older. She is just a couple of years younger than me. She told me it is a momentary fling and she wanted to end it even before I discovered it.

With all the emotional roller coaster going on, she has asked me for time alone to sort out her thoughts and to reflect. She told me she wants to save the marriage, wants us to go marriage counseling (but only after I keep being warm and cold unpredictably, guess she cannot handle it).

Since that 2nd time when I found the guys number I have not found any other signs of her contacting him, but they are colleagues thus I don’t know about office communication etc.

She does seem like she wants to make amends, putting in effort for our new house, and also trying to reassure me more.

That being said, I just don’t feel she is fully disclosing. I’m not sure if I’m overthinking it, and as a result pushing her away.

[Indigoflashed]

Sorry and one more thing to add, she said she only started doing those things she don’t normally do as she felt her biological clock is ticking and she knows she cannot do all those things once we have a child.

I am not female thus I don’t quite understand this thoroughly.

Appreciate all the feedback so far, hope there are female opinions as well to give me a female perspective

[I Love Boobs]

I would like to present her side to the story.

She said she felt bored/distracted, and has since professed that she was wrong. Since the incident, while she has been changing passwords etc, I admit that I have given her a very hard time and severely invaded her privacy by following her, trying to install spyware (but failed) and also doubted what she told me by asking her to show me evidence of where and who she is with (pictures etc)

She said that me being like this is causing her pain and is driving her away, and I know that for a fact, she has been more of an escapist all these years.

The guy isn’t even handsome, in fact, I’m way better looking, fit, and only slightly older. She is just a couple of years younger than me. She told me it is a momentary fling and she wanted to end it even before I discovered it.

With all the emotional roller coaster going on, she has asked me for time alone to sort out her thoughts and to reflect. She told me she wants to save the marriage, wants us to go marriage counseling (but only after I keep being warm and cold unpredictably, guess she cannot handle it).

Since that 2nd time when I found the guys number I have not found any other signs of her contacting him, but they are colleagues thus I don’t know about office communication etc.

She does seem like she wants to make amends, putting in effort for our new house, and also trying to reassure me more.

That being said, I just don’t feel she is fully disclosing. I’m not sure if I’m overthinking it, and as a result pushing her away.

I'll be blunt.
She lied to you on deleting the number and listed it under another name.
That's deliberate deception.
The affair has been ongoing for more than a year based on her desire to dress up etc.
They've definitely fucked. What other reason would the man have to be with her? Conversation? Intellectual enrichment?
Oh, and you'll find a second phone soon that she's using to communicate with her lover. It's a prepaid....

[sammyboyfor]

That is highly idealistic.
It takes years to really know a person.
I didn't know what my wife was for sure.
I'm sure TS will also question who's behind that Brilliant Disguise.
To quote Bruce Springsteen...

I beg to differ. One of the best ways to judge a person's character is to examine the circumstances in which you got to know each other.

A girl you meet at a charity event where she is volunteering for a cause she feels passionate about will have a different set of values compared to one you meet at a club drinking and flirting.

Girls that go about with no makeup, no jewelry and simple clothing are ones that aren't concerned about appearances. Girls that dress to kill with fancy, expensive accessories show all the warning signs that they will be high maintenance.

Another good clue regarding how you'll be treated is to see how your potential partner treats her parents and siblings. If she appears to be self centered and demanding that's how you will be treated too if you marry her.

[I Love Boobs]

I beg to differ. One of the best ways to judge a person's character is to examine the circumstances in which you got to know each other.

A girl you meet at a charity event where she is volunteering for a cause she feels passionate about will have a different set of values compared to one you meet at a club drinking and flirting.

Girls that go about with no makeup, no jewelry and simple clothing are ones that aren't concerned about appearances. Girls that dress to kill with fancy, expensive accessories show all the warning signs that they will be high maintenance.

Another good clue regarding how you'll be treated is to see how your potential partner treats her parents and siblings. If she appears to be self centered and demanding that's how you will be treated too.

Very good advice.
My apologies as I'm pretty jaded with relationships at present....

[Indigoflashed]

I'll be blunt.
She lied to you on deleting the number and listed it under another name.
That's deliberate deception.
The affair has been ongoing for more than a year based on her desire to dress up etc.
They've definitely fucked. What other reason would the man have to be with her? Conversation? Intellectual enrichment?
Oh, and you'll find a second phone soon that she's using to communicate with her lover. It's a prepaid....

Actually I deleted it without her knowledge and I memorized it. I then checked again a week later and it was there. She didn’t say she deleted it...

[Indigoflashed]

Why u both don't try make babies, if she still have a heart for u, paisei hor i think the best way to save this marriage is to have a kid that belong both of u to glue back the relationship. But after have kid liao n she still zao sai then bobian liao. If she don't love u totally she can tell u divorce mah girl heart become hard liao they won't hesitate one. But if u love her u don't taojiak hor.

Bringing babies into the equation if out of the question. It would be unfair for the child and unfair to me if she decides to leave again. Thanks for the advice though

[sammyboyfor]

Why u both don't try make babies, if she still have a heart for u, paisei hor i think the best way to save this marriage is to have a kid that belong both of u to glue back the relationship. But after have kid liao n she still zao sai then bobian liao. If she don't love u totally she can tell u divorce mah girl heart become hard liao they won't hesitate one. But if u love her u don't taojiak hor.

Babies do NOT save a marriage and this is not hearsay. I have personally witnessed two marriages that were strained to breaking point and the couple decided that having a baby would be the solution.

It made matters worse in both cases. Bringing up a child requires teamwork. When you cannot get along with your fellow team member things will escalate further.

However I have seen marriages which are already broken but where a couple stay married for the sake of appearances but I can assure you it's a miserable existence.

[sammyboyfor]

Actually I deleted it without her knowledge and I memorized it. I then checked again a week later and it was there. She didn’t say she deleted it...

You're trying to justify giving her a second chance. However she does not deserve this unless she comes clean.

If she continues to maintain that they have not had sex then you have no idea what else she's lying to you about because I can guarantee you 100% that they have.

I speak from a man's point of view because I certainly wouldn't be wasting a whole year with a girl who won't let me have sex with her. :D The fact that he's still around after a year means he's getting what he wants.

[ilovepantyhose]

有冇搞错？ 你还嫌这顶绿帽不够大？

ts, to her u are a beta provider and she has u eating out of her hand with her lies and excuses

do u have a secret desire of being cuckolded? if u have, monetize it lah at least... (joking ah joking :p)

[Indigoflashed]

You're trying to justify giving her a second chance. However she does not deserve this unless she comes clean.

If she continues to maintain that they have not had sex then you have no idea what else she's lying to you about because I can guarantee you 100% that they have.

I speak from a man's point of view because I certainly wouldn't be wasting a whole year with a girl who won't let me have sex with her. :D The fact that he's still around after a year means he's getting what he wants.


Thank you. Truth is I don’t know how long it has been. I searched her phone thoroughly even after the incident and all I see prior to a month ago are rather platonic work emails. It stepped up after a while and they even had pet names for each other. That happened about a month before I found out which matched he timing she says

A few months ago I also caught her chatting with that guy and she was trying to matchmake him with someone else, so I honestly don’t think it has been a year.

Or am I just delusional

[sammyboyfor]

Thank you. Truth is I don’t know how long it has been. I searched her phone thoroughly even after the incident and all I see prior to a month ago are rather platonic work emails. It stepped up after a while and they even had pet names for each other. That happened about a month before I found out which matched he timing she says

A few months ago I also caught her chatting with that guy and she was trying to matchmake him with someone else, so I honestly don’t think it has been a year.

Or am I just delusional

I am basing my conclusion on your initial post :

About a year ago my wife’s behavior started to change. She started to dress up a lot more, started clubbing and I could also sense her becoming more protective about her cell phone. I didn’t give it much thought initially, as I trusted her wholeheartedly and didn’t imagine she would have an affair, but turns out that I should have listened to my guts much earlier.

If you noticed the change in her behavior a year ago she could have started seeing someone even earlier. Perhaps it was not the same guy. Of course I am only guessing but you asked for advice and I am giving it based upon the facts you presented.

If you revise the facts I will revise my assessment of the situation. :cool:

[Indigoflashed]

I am basing my conclusion on your initial post :



If you noticed the change in her behavior a year ago she could have started seeing someone even earlier. Perhaps it was not the same guy. Of course I am only guessing but you asked for advice and I am giving it based upon the facts you presented.

If you revise the facts I will revise my assessment of the situation. :cool:

I know, and I appreciate that. My facts are all over the place and it is tough to get it in one post.

I am now just trying to figure out if she means it or just lying to me. Also not sure if she will do this again

I’m contemplating contacting the guy to ask for the truth (she said they are not in contact anymore) but honestly if they are cahoots their stories will match (ie only a month no sex etc)

Kinda at a loss, sigh

[sammyboyfor]

I know, and I appreciate that. My facts are all over the place and it is tough to get it in one post.

I am now just trying to figure out if she means it or just lying to me. Also not sure if she will do this again

I’m contemplating contacting the guy to ask for the truth (she said they are not in contact anymore) but honestly if they are cahoots their stories will match (ie only a month no sex etc)

Kinda at a loss, sigh

Leave her and go and stay somewhere else for the time being. Just tell her you're giving her time and space to sort things out and make a decision what she wants to do with the marriage.

If she comes back to you begging for a second chance then you are in a position to call the shots. It gives you the upper hand. In the current situation she is playing you instead.

If she doesn't then it was obviously not meant to be.

[fallen11]

Why u both don't try make babies, if she still have a heart for u, paisei hor i think the best way to save this marriage is to have a kid that belong both of u to glue back the relationship. But after have kid liao n she still zao sai then bobian liao. If she don't love u totally she can tell u divorce mah girl heart become hard liao they won't hesitate one. But if u love her u don't taojiak hor.

will be much worse if it fails.
baby suffer for nothing
divorce becomes more costly and painful
rather jus end it right now
divorce for couples without kid is considered very lucky already
go ask around those with experiences

[I Love Boobs]

Having kids to cement a failing marriage?
TS should be scared if his wife gets pregnant. Likely will be loverboy's baby....
That honestly is useless advice....

[randyrockhard]

When a person's heart has changed, is the marriage/relationship still worth saving?

Ask yourself this question, say the best possible outcome actually happened, that she repented and tried to make amends, would you be able to not hold her hostage forever for her mistakes?

I learned one thing about woman, that we must make them realize that we are VERY capable of leaving them, when they are not on their best behaviours.

Leave now. Take the hit. Your future self would thank you.

[EtherC]

TS have you ever considered that in your relationship she may feel inadequate. That you are too “perfect” & she can’t provide equity in your marriage. Inadvertently she may want to do something to give herself more confidence. Women dun need a “perfect” husband, in fact the motherhood instinct is triggered if you have flaws like being lazy for example. It makes the ladies feel needed.
Perhaps question yourself if you’re using logic to deal with an emotional issue. Might not be the best way forward. Understanding how she feels is important if you still value & love her. 1 mistake does not mean much in the bigger scheme of things. Being vindictive may guilt her into a lower self esteem & push her away further. Just my thoughts & opinion for your reference.

[cuntjigger]

Dun hve to ponder or consider 2nd thought..Just ditch her! Arrrh, u are a nice guy indigo bro.. Too nice! Cheers.. 👌

[peanodood1337]

TS have you ever considered that in your relationship she may feel inadequate. That you are too “perfect” & she can’t provide equity in your marriage. Inadvertently she may want to do something to give herself more confidence. Women dun need a “perfect” husband, in fact the motherhood instinct is triggered if you have flaws like being lazy for example. It makes the ladies feel needed.
Perhaps question yourself if you’re using logic to deal with an emotional issue. Might not be the best way forward. Understanding how she feels is important if you still value & love her. 1 mistake does not mean much in the bigger scheme of things. Being vindictive may guilt her into a lower self esteem & push her away further. Just my thoughts & opinion for your reference.

Sorry, but that's just BS. A husband being "too perfect" is a stupid excuse for cheating on him. Under your logic, guys should aspire to be flawed husbands to keep their wives from straying? Why should TS be penalized for being a good husband?

in fact the motherhood instinct is triggered if you have flaws like being lazy for example. It makes the ladies feel needed.

What do you mean by "in fact"? Don't mislead people into thinking that this is an "instinct". Motherly instincts are inherently self-sacrificial and responsible. It is hardly an impetus for cheating. Girls who cheat using this excuse are just trying to justify their bad behavior with pseudo-science.

Also, in case you are not aware of it, you are victim-bashing by suggesting that it is TS's fault that he's being cheated on.

...

To TS - yes, what EtherC says could be true in that your wife could feel that your marriage is inadequate. But it doesn't mean that it is your fault. Some people will never be satisfied with what they have (like my ex).

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't say it is necessarily your wife's fault either. Ultimately, it boils down to a difference in personalities and outlooks in life. There is a huge disconnect between you guys right now, and you have to decide for yourself if this relationship is worth salvaging.

Personally, I wouldn't bother because I believe "once a cheater, always a cheater".

Good luck bro.

[cleyeo]

Bro TS..

honestly, when a woman has a change of heart,, it will difficult to have her heart changed back. I am not saying all women will be like that, but generally. There was a famous Real Life story of this gentleman, his name is called JEFF SKELTON, his wife name Marilyn.. he loved the wife and daughter so much.. caught her wife having affair with coworker (colleague), forgiven, attending marriage councellour, but secretly the wife never changed. on surface, she showed changes, behind husband's back was totally different. at the end, fatal !!!

you can google JEFF SKELTON.. I think you tube has the on police investigation on this case,, quite nice to watch !! search LAST BREATH in youtube.

my advice, both of you have more communication. if really cant,, better go separate way !! this is my opinion.

good luck to you !!

[Indigoflashed]

Thank you all for the responses. A lot have happened since the and I would appreciate your thoughts

She confessed everything to me over the weekend. Last week she went on a work trip and I knew something was amiss, so when she returned I checked her phone again. She got careless, I found photos of her and her lover.

When I confronted her, she confessed everything. I will not go into the details but it was as bad as I can think and more.

After she did, I get tremendous sadness, but at the same time, liberation. I am not crazy, I wasn’t imagining things, I was right about all those suspicious behavior.

You may all think I’m mad, but I decided to forgive her. She told me she felt that I haven’t given her enough attention, and she managed to get that from that guy even though she has no feelings for him.

After the confession things felt very different, it feels like she was willing to talk again, it feels like she wanted to let me know every mistake she made. I could sense remorse, but at the same time, she said she lost a lot of feelings for me when I became a paranoid freak and tried to track her every move.

To end off we agreed to go for marriage counselling, these couple of days we shared about how we feel and what we can do better. I’m still deeply hurt, but I’m trying to trust and forgive her. Deep down I have a immense fear that something like this will happen again, but when you love someone I guess you are just hopelessly optimistic.

I hope I have no more updates. It’s been a extremely difficult 2 months and I’m frankly spent. Hope things can only get better from now on.

[peanodood1337]

Thank you all for the responses. A lot have happened since the and I would appreciate your thoughts

She confessed everything to me over the weekend. Last week she went on a work trip and I knew something was amiss, so when she returned I checked her phone again. She got careless, I found photos of her and her lover.

When I confronted her, she confessed everything. I will not go into the details but it was as bad as I can think and more.

After she did, I get tremendous sadness, but at the same time, liberation. I am not crazy, I wasn’t imagining things, I was right about all those suspicious behavior.

You may all think I’m mad, but I decided to forgive her. She told me she felt that I haven’t given her enough attention, and she managed to get that from that guy even though she has no feelings for him.

After the confession things felt very different, it feels like she was willing to talk again, it feels like she wanted to let me know every mistake she made. I could sense remorse, but at the same time, she said she lost a lot of feelings for me when I became a paranoid freak and tried to track her every move.

To end off we agreed to go for marriage counselling, these couple of days we shared about how we feel and what we can do better. I’m still deeply hurt, but I’m trying to trust and forgive her. Deep down I have a immense fear that something like this will happen again, but when you love someone I guess you are just hopelessly optimistic.

I hope I have no more updates. It’s been a extremely difficult 2 months and I’m frankly spent. Hope things can only get better from now on.

You are a man with a big heart. I hope that your wife doesn't let you down again.

And nope, you are not mad for choosing to forgive your wife. There is no wrong or right answer for these things. Its your life, and you are free to choose how you want to live it. Just make sure that you are ready to deal with the consequences of your actions.

All the best with your marriage bro. Keeping our fingers crossed that the next update you have on this thread is about the success of your marriage counseling.

[sammyboyfor]

You're going to find it very hard to restore your trust.

Even with counseling her betrayal will start gnawing at your emotions and the resentment will build up over time.

The fact that she is blaming you does not bode well either. If marriage vows can just be broken because she perceived that she wasn't getting enough attention they obviously don't mean much to her.

My advice would be to call it a day. Forgiveness is a noble gesture but the scars will remain no matter what.

It will hurt at the beginning but time always heals.

Thank you all for the responses. A lot have happened since the and I would appreciate your thoughts

She confessed everything to me over the weekend. Last week she went on a work trip and I knew something was amiss, so when she returned I checked her phone again. She got careless, I found photos of her and her lover.

When I confronted her, she confessed everything. I will not go into the details but it was as bad as I can think and more.

After she did, I get tremendous sadness, but at the same time, liberation. I am not crazy, I wasn’t imagining things, I was right about all those suspicious behavior.

You may all think I’m mad, but I decided to forgive her. She told me she felt that I haven’t given her enough attention, and she managed to get that from that guy even though she has no feelings for him.

After the confession things felt very different, it feels like she was willing to talk again, it feels like she wanted to let me know every mistake she made. I could sense remorse, but at the same time, she said she lost a lot of feelings for me when I became a paranoid freak and tried to track her every move.

To end off we agreed to go for marriage counselling, these couple of days we shared about how we feel and what we can do better. I’m still deeply hurt, but I’m trying to trust and forgive her. Deep down I have a immense fear that something like this will happen again, but when you love someone I guess you are just hopelessly optimistic.

I hope I have no more updates. It’s been a extremely difficult 2 months and I’m frankly spent. Hope things can only get better from now on.

[seekerJ]

Hi TS,

I had been following your thread and I am happy that both of you are able to communicate openly to each other and solve the real problem together.

I totally know all your feeling from the agony & devastation of uncovering the betrayal and denial of the truth but yet have to swallow it as a bitter pill.
A lot of emotions and questions running up upon your mind and been suspicious of her which you had given her trust fully.

I had been through it and I understand why you choose to forgive her. Because I would have done the same thing as you do. When you truly love someone, you will choose to forgive her no matter what she had done wrong. As long she is fully remorsed and repented in her heart and want to amend all things even it will cause her to be shameful. It’s not easy to admit it and also fully open to her flaws & feeling to you. You want to solve the problem, you have to admit there’s a problem. If she really mean it, I can say there’s still have a chance to save this marriage. If she still love you, then she deserve to be forgiven.

Everyone situation is unique and it always up to you to decide. Choose to listen your inner voice/ gut feeling because you already know the answer. You would rather deny it because that may not be what you want.

[Indigoflashed]

Thank you all for the feedback and responses. Each one of them provides me with a different perspective and allowed me to think it though.

I decided to forgive, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. The scars will probably remain forever. That being said no one is perfect, and i think she is truely sorry about her mistake.

My initial reaction was to give it up, screw it and find another girl who is worth my time. The scenes of which she was lying to me while she had another guy by her side kept replaying in my mind, and it truly hurts

But as I recall the find memories of the last 10 years before this, she has given me a lot as well. She gave me her youth, treats my family and her family very well, cooks often for me, and cheers me up often. I love her for who she is, and I truly believe she got lost momentarily, and she needs people around her who loves her to guide her back. I’m willing to do that.

As I wrote this I cannot help but shed tears again. The pain is still there, and probably will never go away, but for a long as she is willing to repent and make amends I’ll be there for her. Perhaps one day I’ll blow up and that may be the end, or she may violate again, but until then, I’ll strive to save my marriage and guide the woman I love back to where she should be

[sammyboyfor]

You are forgiving her based upon what she was in the past when what you should be doing is judging her based on the present situation.

Reminiscing will cloud your judgement.

Thank you all for the feedback and responses. Each one of them provides me with a different perspective and allowed me to think it though.

I decided to forgive, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. The scars will probably remain forever. That being said no one is perfect, and i think she is truely sorry about her mistake.

My initial reaction was to give it up, screw it and find another girl who is worth my time. The scenes of which she was lying to me while she had another guy by her side kept replaying in my mind, and it truly hurts

But as I recall the find memories of the last 10 years before this, she has given me a lot as well. She gave me her youth, treats my family and her family very well, cooks often for me, and cheers me up often. I love her for who she is, and I truly believe she got lost momentarily, and she needs people around her who loves her to guide her back. I’m willing to do that.

As I wrote this I cannot help but shed tears again. The pain is still there, and probably will never go away, but for a long as she is willing to repent and make amends I’ll be there for her. Perhaps one day I’ll blow up and that may be the end, or she may violate again, but until then, I’ll strive to save my marriage and guide the woman I love back to where she should be

[seekerJ]

Thank you all for the feedback and responses. Each one of them provides me with a different perspective and allowed me to think it though.

I decided to forgive, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. The scars will probably remain forever. That being said no one is perfect, and i think she is truely sorry about her mistake.

My initial reaction was to give it up, screw it and find another girl who is worth my time. The scenes of which she was lying to me while she had another guy by her side kept replaying in my mind, and it truly hurts

But as I recall the find memories of the last 10 years before this, she has given me a lot as well. She gave me her youth, treats my family and her family very well, cooks often for me, and cheers me up often. I love her for who she is, and I truly believe she got lost momentarily, and she needs people around her who loves her to guide her back. I’m willing to do that.

As I wrote this I cannot help but shed tears again. The pain is still there, and probably will never go away, but for a long as she is willing to repent and make amends I’ll be there for her. Perhaps one day I’ll blow up and that may be the end, or she may violate again, but until then, I’ll strive to save my marriage and guide the woman I love back to where she should be

Bro.. time will really heal all wounds but scar will still be there and it may haunt you back again.

But just my 2 cents worth of warning for you.
I can assure you that the relationship will never be the same again, all of it already past.

You can’t trust her as you used to be.
She may not the same person as you used to know.

She may have guilt initially while meeting other guys but slowly she will find her own reasons to justify her act or push the blame and get herself guiltless sooner or later. Then their relationship will escalate by doing things more n more intimate till no point of return. 一步错 步步错

The moment she forsake of you and be someone else behind your back, she already done wrong to you, no matter whatever reason is it.
She already lost you in her heart & mind that she think it’s alright to be someone else. While knowing her Husband that love her so much and trusting her, will be deeping hurt to find out.

I may ask, after you found out the affair and if she truly repent and want to do things right. Why she didn’t have a clean cut of relationship with that guy?
Why still communicate each other and having photo together in the phone? If it’s just a month of rs, shouldn’t be that hard to end it?
For woman, I don’t understand that she can be with someone with no feeling?

Does she truly repent and seek forgiven? Or is there any hidden agenda?
For my case, I was afraid of my ex fiancée seeking forgiven just to wait for the affair to blow over. Then, after a few month or a year she might break off with me for other reason like we no more feeling/love. She will get off the name of betrayal that this rs end. I might think too much but I feel she have to pay for what she had done. (maybe I turn revengeful or unfairly treated)
If I was the one (betray), she definitely want me to pay for what I had done.
Sometime I feel its pretty unfair for the guy, when their partner betray him and she can simply get away with it. (I guess that Man have to bear it as a Man)

Hope you have the answer on the questions above in the right mind so there’s nothing to hold you back while saving this marriage.

Whatever decision TS made, I will still support it.
Go for the last fight, whatever the result, you have done your best with no regret. All the best to you.

[cleyeo]

I would suggest to all bros to not bring this issue anymore since TS has forgiven her.

We should wish him all the best, hope their relation will be strong again !!

jia you !!

[I Love Boobs]

She cheated on you and denied it.
She still kept in contact with the dude after she was busted.
She went off for a weekend fuck with loverboy.
Knowing full well you would check her phone, she left pictures of herself and loverboy for you to see.
And you forgive her?
Hoping for a fresh start?
You've conceded way too much territory....
You're the most beta guy I've ever heard of.
You need to grow some balls and dump this slut.

Well, alternatively ask mummy but don't reminisce.
State the facts in point form like above.
I'm sure she'll concur....

I actually consulted my parents when my ex fucked up my life and took away my kids....
And emptied out our joint account...
Divorce is painful but sometimes you need to cut your losses.
What's the worst that can happen?
She gets pregnant.
You're so happy.
You raise the kid as your own.
Your parents are so happy!
Then you realise that the kid is loverboy's....

I mean well because I've been there before.
Unlike you I would have lived a meaningless marriage because of my kids...
Count your blessings you have no kids yet.
A close friend of mine found out his Daughter wasn't his through DNA testing.
He divorced his Wife but could not get past the depression. "His Daughter" was 7...
I attended his funeral a few weeks back when he committed suicide....

[seekerJ]

She cheated on you and denied it.
She still kept in contact with the dude after she was busted.
She went off for a weekend fuck with loverboy.
Knowing full well you would check her phone, she left pictures of herself and loverboy for you to see.
And you forgive her?
Hoping for a fresh start?
You've conceded way too much territory....
You're the most beta guy I've ever heard of.
You need to grow some balls and dump this slut.

Well, alternatively ask mummy but don't reminisce.
State the facts in point form like above.
I'm sure she'll concur....

I actually consulted my parents when my ex fucked up my life and took away my kids....
And emptied out our joint account...
Divorce is painful but sometimes you need to cut your losses.
What's the worst that can happen?
She gets pregnant.
You're so happy.
You raise the kid as your own.
Your parents are so happy!
Then you realise that the kid is loverboy's....

I mean well because I've been there before.
Unlike you I would have lived a meaningless marriage because of my kids...
Count your blessings you have no kids yet.
A close friend of mine found out his Daughter wasn't his through DNA testing.
He divorced his Wife but could not get past the depression. "His Daughter" was 7...
I attended his funeral a few weeks back when he committed suicide....

Sorry to hear your story and your close friend. RIP to him.

[Shadow_warrior]

She cheated on you and denied it.
She still kept in contact with the dude after she was busted.
She went off for a weekend fuck with loverboy.
Knowing full well you would check her phone, she left pictures of herself and loverboy for you to see.
And you forgive her?
Hoping for a fresh start?
You've conceded way too much territory....
You're the most beta guy I've ever heard of.
You need to grow some balls and dump this slut.

Well, alternatively ask mummy but don't reminisce.
State the facts in point form like above.
I'm sure she'll concur....

I actually consulted my parents when my ex fucked up my life and took away my kids....
And emptied out our joint account...
Divorce is painful but sometimes you need to cut your losses.
What's the worst that can happen?
She gets pregnant.
You're so happy.
You raise the kid as your own.
Your parents are so happy!
Then you realise that the kid is loverboy's....

I mean well because I've been there before.
Unlike you I would have lived a meaningless marriage because of my kids...
Count your blessings you have no kids yet.
A close friend of mine found out his Daughter wasn't his through DNA testing.
He divorced his Wife but could not get past the depression. "His Daughter" was 7...
I attended his funeral a few weeks back when he committed suicide....

been there with my exes. 6 dating relationships, 6 cheated. Glad no kids and didn't marry those women

Married the 7th one.

Women are not the ones we knew in the past, or our parents time.

Men have become more women like, women have become men like and dominant.

The world is different now.

[pixlover2016]

I remember when I was 17 years old, my 19 years old boyfriend claimed that he was in NS doing extra duties so could not book out to meet me for my birthday.

But I suddenly received a msg from my poly friend that she saw my bf near a club flirting with a girl.

I got angry and told her that my bf was in NS, so she must had seen wrongly.

In the end, she sms me the address and asked me to verify it myself.

I spent 15 dollars plus to grab a cab and went down. Called my friend to update me where they were now. She told me they checked in to a hotel.

I waited outside with her and time was slow somehow.

I waited and waited....hoping everything was just a mistake.

But then when I saw my bf hugging a lady's waist and walked out of the hotel, I really felt the pain....

I went up and confronted them. Bf tried to deny it , saying he was just helping her to bed to rest as she felt dizzy.

But the more he tried to deny, the more loopholes in his lies...

We had a big quarrel while the lady my bf was seeing ran away fast.

My friend and I quarreled with him non stop until he finally admitted he went to bed with her as a fling.

It took me about a year or more to get over this betrayal and moved on.
Looking back, I think even if I forgive him, things would still be the same. The moment he decided to lie, he would lie even more to cover up more lies.

[sammyboyfor]

TS, if u have set your mind about something and going counselling etc. I strongly suggest u to stay away from reading all the posting for the time being. Its important to have a clear mind n not have prejudice or bias. Infos feed to your brain may affect your decision subconsciously without you realizing it.

It is equally important to display sound judgement and reading this thread will help achieve that.

[Indigoflashed]

I really do appreciate all the feedback, and I made a measured decision from these inputs. I forgave her not because I was reminiscing, but because she showed remorse and I could sense that she has come clean.

We now have to overcome this ordeal and it will not be easy no doubt, thus I seek the help of anyone whose marriage has survived an ordeal like this and happy now.

I need tips, pointers drawn from your personal experiences on how to manage this. Anything at all will help!

[larue]

Yes, she may be remorseful, and you forgiving and hopefully it's all good from here on.

Don't forget though that you married someone who values excitement, attention and affection, but puts very little stock in your hard work, sacrifice and responsibility.

'I paid for her education, the car, the house, the renovation, most of our outings, and I never asked her to do a job against her wishes. She practically didn’t have to worry about anything financially.'

What will not change are these values. And you are sure you can deal with it going forward?

You have to be coldly objective about what you want from this relationship, what you can put in, and what you expect in return.

Cos if you're going to continue to put in exactly what you have been putting in so far, you're likely to receive again what you just did.

[Indigoflashed]

Yes, she may be remorseful, and you forgiving and hopefully it's all good from here on.

Don't forget though that you married someone who values excitement, attention and affection, but puts very little stock in your hard work, sacrifice and responsibility.

'I paid for her education, the car, the house, the renovation, most of our outings, and I never asked her to do a job against her wishes. She practically didn’t have to worry about anything financially.'

What will not change are these values. And you are sure you can deal with it going forward?

You have to be coldly objective about what you want from this relationship, what you can put in, and what you expect in return.

Cos if you're going to continue to put in exactly what you have been putting in so far, you're likely to receive again what you just did.

That is very true, which is why I have to reassess how I should put into this marriage. In many ways this is like a new marriage, I have to learn how to treat her and draw our boundaries. I also have to work on communicating what I expect from her from now on, which is equal dedication to the things that matter to us.

Perhaps I have spoilt her too much and she didn’t realize how hard one has to work to get a comfortable life. But wise words indeed and thank you for them

[sammyboyfor]

That is very true, which is why I have to reassess how I should put into this marriage. In many ways this is like a new marriage, I have to learn how to treat her and draw our boundaries. I also have to work on communicating what I expect from her from now on, which is equal dedication to the things that matter to us.

Perhaps I have spoilt her too much and she didn’t realize how hard one has to work to get a comfortable life. But wise words indeed and thank you for them

Your wife has a character flaw and character is hardwired and very difficult to change.

In my opinion her remorse is over getting caught more than anything else. She pushed her luck and continued with her deceit until the evidence was irrefutable before she came clean. Of course it's just an opinion but it's based upon my own experiences regarding relationships.

My guess is she has assessed the relationship and decided it is against her interests to lose you hence the display of regret and the willingness to give it another go. In other words it's all about her and nobody else.

However somewhere down the road she may start feeling neglected again and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

You on the other hand will go all out to make her feel even more loved and treasured this time round to try to prevent a relapse. The net result is that she has benefitted from this episode while you are losing out when it should be the other way round.

[I Love Boobs]

Your wife has a character flaw and character is hardwired and very difficult to change.

In my opinion her remorse is over getting caught more than anything else. She pushed her luck and continued with her deceit until the evidence was irrefutable before she came clean. Of course it's just an opinion but it's based upon my own experiences regarding relationships.

My guess is she has assessed the relationship and decided it is against her interests to lose you hence the display of regret and the willingness to give it another go. In other words it's all about her and nobody else.

However somewhere down the road she may start feeling neglected again and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

You on the other hand will go all out to make her feel even more loved and treasured this time round to try to prevent a relapse. The net result is that she has benefitted from this episode while you are losing out when it should be the other way round.

TS is probably rich and with resources. Likely old money.
This woman will deplete your resources and leave you when you're broke.
Just wait and see. Since your response actually encourages her to perpetuate her behaviour.
Basically she's getting rewarded for cheating on you.
This will not end well.

[apppioneer]

The problem is that finding companionship in a wife is the exception rather than the norm.

Men have to take part of the blame for this because they choose the girl that is the most attractive and the best fuck at the time rather than someone that they could bond with on a more spiritual level.

In order for a marriage to work a wife has to be best friend first and foremost. Sex should be secondary. This is because friendship based upon common interests and value systems will far outlast the sexual part of the relationship.
Hi Brother, i have been looking you for similiar situation. i need your help. i pmed you as i need to move on from my shitty past.

Please help.

[jenoroth]

thank god for this forum and topics like these that made me realised that marriage these days are too risky.

70% of divorces are initiated by women in singapore. add that with the protection of women's charter and you are going to be stripped off your dignity, emotional sanctity and your financials.

Only the stupid get married.

[I Love Boobs]

thank god for this forum and topics like these that made me realised that marriage these days are too risky.

70% of divorces are initiated by women in singapore. add that with the protection of women's charter and you are going to be stripped off your dignity, emotional sanctity and your financials.

Only the stupid get married.

Societal pressure will mean that if you're in a relationship with a girl, you'll be pressured to marry her.
Co-habiting is still not kosher here.
Then after marriage, the girl has an open Licence to:
- stop work and demand your paycheck
- grow sloppy and fat
- meet and screw other guys because you've "neglected" her.
- be an absolute bitch and control your money, time, make you do chores and take care of the baby (who may be due to cuckolding)
Smart man you!

[Bullshitlar]

I would like to present her side to the story.

She said she felt bored/distracted, and has since professed that she was wrong. Since the incident, while she has been changing passwords etc, I admit that I have given her a very hard time and severely invaded her privacy by following her, trying to install spyware (but failed) and also doubted what she told me by asking her to show me evidence of where and who she is with (pictures etc)

She said that me being like this is causing her pain and is driving her away, and I know that for a fact, she has been more of an escapist all these years.

The guy isn’t even handsome, in fact, I’m way better looking, fit, and only slightly older. She is just a couple of years younger than me. She told me it is a momentary fling and she wanted to end it even before I discovered it.

With all the emotional roller coaster going on, she has asked me for time alone to sort out her thoughts and to reflect. She told me she wants to save the marriage, wants us to go marriage counseling (but only after I keep being warm and cold unpredictably, guess she cannot handle it).

Since that 2nd time when I found the guys number I have not found any other signs of her contacting him, but they are colleagues thus I don’t know about office communication etc.

She does seem like she wants to make amends, putting in effort for our new house, and also trying to reassure me more.

That being said, I just don’t feel she is fully disclosing. I’m not sure if I’m overthinking it, and as a result pushing her away.

End it. Many of us have been through cheating n i can tell you, the relationship is broken. Will never ever be the same. You deserved better. Life will be better once u accept the fact it is over.

Dont drag on the pain. Pointless.

[Bullshitlar]

been there with my exes. 6 dating relationships, 6 cheated. Glad no kids and didn't marry those women

Married the 7th one.

Women are not the ones we knew in the past, or our parents time.

Men have become more women like, women have become men like and dominant.

The world is different now.

I agree with u on that. Woman now behavior like man from the 60s...

[fallen11]

had 11 gfs before
6 of them cheated
the rest i didnt cheat on any of them.
broke up due to non 3rd party reasons.

[Shadow_warrior]

I agree with u on that. Woman now behavior like man from the 60s...

I know a woman who has divorced from her husband based on husband's infidelity but what the husband didn't know through the process is while he was fucking another woman(single lady), his wife was also fucking someone husband. So the poor fucker is paying alimony even though his wife was cheating too. Imagine the difference in the outcome if he had known her dark deeds too.

But she had the holier than thou attitude, telling the whole world the husband cheated. If confronted about her own actions she remarked that 1. she was only playing with this other man. 2. she will let go anytime she is discovered by the other guys wife 3. she doesn't want to break up his marriage(so she is more moral than her husband and the lass he is banging)

so women can be scary. they can so critical of the man's indiscretions but when its their own, they can hide the darkest secrets and her female mates will side her and cover the matter with her in justification. neither does she care that the husband's woman whom she deem as a slut, is really a reflection of her. she doesn't care about the feelings of the woman whose husband she is screwing too.

for her pic. look at my recent post in milf

all I can say is poor bro. if only you knew.

[0541774]

I honestly think that commercial sex is the way to go. It's cheaper, more enjoyable and offers far more variety.

For example instead of trying to persuade a wife to have a threesome all you need to do is book two girls for a tarma session.

If you want anal sex offer the right girl enough money and your wishes are granted.

The $4000 per month could you buying you $400 high quality fucks 10 times a month which is more than twice per week. This is far more sex than most people get from their wives after a few years of marriage.

The best part of the deal is you don't have to fuck the same girl 10 times a month you can have a fresh new face on a regular basis.

Once in a while you can treat yourself to a high quality $2000 fuck and you'll still be saving money compared to what a marriage costs.

Hahaha..power la, I like your logic!

[I Love Boobs]

Went dating tonight to expand my social circle....
Loneliness can be biting.
Fucking waste of my time.
30+ professional, over the hill.
Fantastic sense of entitlement.
Then she tells me that she has a bf....
No common topics.
All about accumulation of financial wealth....
And she still owes her former BF $300k for investment in her business and education. She has no intention to repay him....

[poi123]

Hi Ts, leopard will not change it spots. Not trying to pour cold water but i believe these words still exist for its reason.

If one day you not able to recall those scene, i will say u have truely forgiven her. Till then it happen, make sure you still have these evidences and safe keep for further use.

Even some parents also betray their kids let alone wife. But of cos those kind of parents are only a handful.

Next you should do its to get out of this thread and this forum to avoid reciving more suggestions to distract your will in mending this relationship which you believe.

[Xia406]

The problem is that finding companionship in a wife is the exception rather than the norm.

Men have to take part of the blame for this because they choose the girl that is the most attractive and the best fuck at the time rather than someone that they could bond with on a more spiritual level.

In order for a marriage to work a wife has to be best friend first and foremost. Sex should be secondary. This is because friendship based upon common interests and value systems will far outlast the sexual part of the relationship.

This advice is worth a pot of gold from the boss.

[Xia406]

I would like to present her side to the story.

She said she felt bored/distracted, and has since professed that she was wrong. Since the incident, while she has been changing passwords etc, I admit that I have given her a very hard time and severely invaded her privacy by following her, trying to install spyware (but failed) and also doubted what she told me by asking her to show me evidence of where and who she is with (pictures etc)

She said that me being like this is causing her pain and is driving her away, and I know that for a fact, she has been more of an escapist all these years.

The guy isn’t even handsome, in fact, I’m way better looking, fit, and only slightly older. She is just a couple of years younger than me. She told me it is a momentary fling and she wanted to end it even before I discovered it.

With all the emotional roller coaster going on, she has asked me for time alone to sort out her thoughts and to reflect. She told me she wants to save the marriage, wants us to go marriage counseling (but only after I keep being warm and cold unpredictably, guess she cannot handle it).

Since that 2nd time when I found the guys number I have not found any other signs of her contacting him, but they are colleagues thus I don’t know about office communication etc.

She does seem like she wants to make amends, putting in effort for our new house, and also trying to reassure me more.

That being said, I just don’t feel she is fully disclosing. I’m not sure if I’m overthinking it, and as a result pushing her away.

TS there is a very simple saying, the more you want to hang on to something, the more resistance you will face.

In other words, learn to let go. If you really love her, let her go and find her own happiness, and you try to find yours too.

If she returns in kind, then you will know that she is yours. If she doesn't, that it was never mean to be. I am speaking this because I have my fair share of experiences as well.

[fallen11]

Went dating tonight to expand my social circle....
Loneliness can be biting.
Fucking waste of my time.
30+ professional, over the hill.
Fantastic sense of entitlement.
Then she tells me that she has a bf....
No common topics.
All about accumulation of financial wealth....
And she still owes her former BF $300k for investment in her business and education. She has no intention to repay him....

thats actually very good.
show u her truthful self from the start.
otherwise who knows u might end up paying your own 300k to know her real pattern

[Lucifypunk]

Hey, just to share my own personal experience.
I’ve never been married but I’ve been with a guy who has decided to cheat on me more than 5 times on different occasions.
And yes, I forgave him 5 times. No one approves of our relationship, none of my friends like him because of what he did, only our parents are oblivious to what went on between us.
The first time, not so bad.
But the more it happened, it destroyed every little bit of trust I had. I checked his phone, made sure he told me his passwords, doubted him many times etc
And as usual, he started getting defensive about it, saying that he wants his privacy, he felt I was being crazy and controlling yada yada.

It just wouldn’t be the same again, and I miss that. It hurt me, so bad. That I get nightmares time to time, and I start crying in my sleep.
I sometimes start thinking about it and start having a breakdown.

As a girlfriend, I don’t force any rules on him. In fact, he is allowed to find prostitutes or go for happy massages. I don’t ask for any material items or monies, I don’t demand anything except for honesty, and I don’t throw my temper at him. But what I can’t stand, and I’m sure most girls can’t, is cheating emotionally. It came to a point where he started sleeping over at the 3rd party’s house, meeting her parents etc. It broke me. And it didn’t happen just one time.

If you’re wondering why I forgave him, it was because I really do enjoy the good times with him. I have a big heart. Vulnerable, but full of forgiveness. But we all have our limits.
He woke the fuck up one day when I packed his clothes and left it outside my house. As much as his mistakes hurt me, I didn’t want to continue getting hurt over the same reasons again.

We didn’t see each other for about 5 months, then I decided to let him back into my life again. But all that hurt has built up my tolerance, now that I see myself deserving something more. And he is aware that I ain’t giving any more chances. Just because I was trying to make it perfect for me, I neglected my friends, affected my career, drifted from my family just cuz I stuck by him wherever he went. Now, I made it clear to him if he were to fuck up again, I won’t hesitate to kick him out cuz I’d put my career first and I’ll only share my success with him if by the time I achieve it, he is still next to me. As much as I want to believe that people can change bad habits, I don’t wanna be the one always sacrificing.

Currently we are still together, he sleeps over at my house every night, made sure we say goodnight to each other everyday, he decided to be open with his phone, and after awhile I don’t feel the need to look into it again(maybe once in a few months). He changed, but It won’t go back to how it was, but you can only hope that the bad won’t happen again, cuz there’s always a possibility people will go back to how they were.
I’ve known guys who continuously cheat their whole life, and also men who decide to commit when it’s time to grow the fuck up and focus on a long term relationship.

[Indigoflashed]

Hey, just to share my own personal experience.
I’ve never been married but I’ve been with a guy who has decided to cheat on me more than 5 times on different occasions.
And yes, I forgave him 5 times. No one approves of our relationship, none of my friends like him because of what he did, only our parents are oblivious to what went on between us.
The first time, not so bad.
But the more it happened, it destroyed every little bit of trust I had. I checked his phone, made sure he told me his passwords, doubted him many times etc
And as usual, he started getting defensive about it, saying that he wants his privacy, he felt I was being crazy and controlling yada yada.

It just wouldn’t be the same again, and I miss that. It hurt me, so bad. That I get nightmares time to time, and I start crying in my sleep.
I sometimes start thinking about it and start having a breakdown.

As a girlfriend, I don’t force any rules on him. In fact, he is allowed to find prostitutes or go for happy massages. I don’t ask for any material items or monies, I don’t demand anything except for honesty, and I don’t throw my temper at him. But what I can’t stand, and I’m sure most girls can’t, is cheating emotionally. It came to a point where he started sleeping over at the 3rd party’s house, meeting her parents etc. It broke me. And it didn’t happen just one time.

If you’re wondering why I forgave him, it was because I really do enjoy the good times with him. I have a big heart. Vulnerable, but full of forgiveness. But we all have our limits.
He woke the fuck up one day when I packed his clothes and left it outside my house. As much as his mistakes hurt me, I didn’t want to continue getting hurt over the same reasons again.

We didn’t see each other for about 5 months, then I decided to let him back into my life again. But all that hurt has built up my tolerance, now that I see myself deserving something more. And he is aware that I ain’t giving any more chances. Just because I was trying to make it perfect for me, I neglected my friends, affected my career, drifted from my family just cuz I stuck by him wherever he went. Now, I made it clear to him if he were to fuck up again, I won’t hesitate to kick him out cuz I’d put my career first and I’ll only share my success with him if by the time I achieve it, he is still next to me. As much as I want to believe that people can change bad habits, I don’t wanna be the one always sacrificing.

Currently we are still together, he sleeps over at my house every night, made sure we say goodnight to each other everyday, he decided to be open with his phone, and after awhile I don’t feel the need to look into it again(maybe once in a few months). He changed, but It won’t go back to how it was, but you can only hope that the bad won’t happen again, cuz there’s always a possibility people will go back to how they were.
I’ve known guys who continuously cheat their whole life, and also men who decide to commit when it’s time to grow the fuck up and focus on a long term relationship.

Wtf 5 times???? You certainly have a big heart Sis

[Indigoflashed]

TS there is a very simple saying, the more you want to hang on to something, the more resistance you will face.

In other words, learn to let go. If you really love her, let her go and find her own happiness, and you try to find yours too.

If she returns in kind, then you will know that she is yours. If she doesn't, that it was never mean to be. I am speaking this because I have my fair share of experiences as well.

Thank you. This is very true. I will focus on myself going forward instead of her and if she is meant to be mine she will be

[LoveAffair]

Been there done that.

I’m 30. Already have kids. Taking care alone. I been thru far worst than u. If u need somebody to talk. To drink. To chill do let me know. Sometimes talking out with someone who has the same plight or worst than u helps.

I may still be recovering after so many years. But I garauntee u that time heals. It’s been 4-5 years and I’m still healing.

The reason I’m still single is not that I’m ugly. But I have lost faith in marriage. Or any kind of relationships. I focus my life on my kids daily and spent as much quality time with them as possible. It all happens only during honeymoon period where is the sweetest and then it’s gone forever.

Talk to me. Let me help u. U can pm me.

[jameschong1]

[QUOTE=Shadow_warrior;17763475]I know a woman who has divorced from her husband based on husband's infidelity but what the husband didn't know through the process is while he was fucking another woman(single lady), his wife was also fucking someone husband. So the poor fucker is paying alimony even though his wife was cheating too. Imagine the difference in the outcome if he had known her dark deeds too.

the poor fucker wear green hat while the woman wear the burger king crown
i nvr marry because i m ugly or poor.
too many choices, dun know who to marry

[apppioneer]

Been there done that.

I’m 30. Already have kids. Taking care alone. I been thru far worst than u. If u need somebody to talk. To drink. To chill do let me know. Sometimes talking out with someone who has the same plight or worst than u helps.

I may still be recovering after so many years. But I garauntee u that time heals. It’s been 4-5 years and I’m still healing.

The reason I’m still single is not that I’m ugly. But I have lost faith in marriage. Or any kind of relationships. I focus my life on my kids daily and spent as much quality time with them as possible. It all happens only during honeymoon period where is the sweetest and then it’s gone forever.

Talk to me. Let me help u. U can pm me.

i read your old thread about love affair.

i just went thru terrible xp last year and false relationship lasted for a yr.

I wanna understand. How did you get thru with your life after 5 years? Did anyone help you get back to your feet to continue living? Are your kids your motivation to continue fighting?

[JJwoosh]

We men can be so emo at times. It’s so logical yet illogical. Realized from most stories, logical thing to do is to walk away. But here we are thinking of how best to keep things. When giving advice, we are all so clear but when shit happens, we are equally if not more confused.

[0541774]

If you’re wondering why I forgave him, it was because I really do enjoy the good times with him.

What did he do to make u enjoy the good times?

[Lucifypunk]

What did he do to make u enjoy the good times?

The times we spend together is something that we don’t get from anyone else. There’s nothing specific that he has done. He did make sure I get the idea that he wants to wife me (having joint accounts, getting with my fam etc) but the only thing I really want is him to become a better version of himself.
I don’t ask for money, I don’t demand him to report to me every hour and I don’t restrict him from hanging out with anyone at all.

I know how most guys(not all) like freshness in their sex lives once in awhile, but sex is nothing until feelings get involved. And for some reason my bf gets emotionally attached to whoever he decides to play with. That’s only thing I wish would change.

To be able to be a honest and loyal person, will change a lot of aspects of your life.

[shamechong1]

Very well said Boss:D

The problem is that finding companionship in a wife is the exception rather than the norm.

Men have to take part of the blame for this because they choose the girl that is the most attractive and the best fuck at the time rather than someone that they could bond with on a more spiritual level.

In order for a marriage to work a wife has to be best friend first and foremost. Sex should be secondary. This is because friendship based upon common interests and value systems will far outlast the sexual part of the relationship.

[jameschong1]

Very well said Boss:D
this shamechong1 go around calling boss
very shame indeed, to the Chong ancestors
shamechong - dog bone for u

[shamechong1]

Are you crazy or mad?:confused:

this shamechong1 go around calling boss
very shame indeed, to the Chong ancestors
shamechong - dog bone for u

[jenoroth]

Only stupid people get married nowadays.

[Ohyah75]

Just to share.....

Honestly speaking, i dont have very good impression on this web or rather, i hate this forum. This is the place i know tat my husband went special service and prostitution, Even till to date.. But after seriously browsing this site, i have started to change abit. There r still some ppl out there.....

We have been married for many many years. In the first year of marriage i realised tat he went to special sevice.
Everytime i confronted him and promised he will changed and went there due to his workstress. With his promised, i have forgave him again again and again. During the first confront, i should stand firm to leave him. Then my 2 cutie will not suffer from their parents....

This year things happen again early this year... And this time round is the worst. He even lended out our 5 digit saving to a woman he dun even know. The words he is using is impulsive. Impulsive to find woman, impulsive to lend out the money.... I went into suicide depression.... went to see doc and i have managed to stand up by myself in months. I have been thinking where i have done wrong to make him do all this.... even till to date... u all must be thinking...... cos i have not give enough to him.... i can only tell say this when a wife request a hug, the husband asked her to hug other ppl.....

All this while, I have asked he if he has done HIV test. answer is no..... have been asking him to go but he is finding excuse....

I have been thinking for my 2 kids before i take decision to leave him. Yes this time round im very firm to leave him and will bring up my 2 kids alone....

The hurting part is the betrayal. Can man accept wife to play around? I know some of the ppl will say why not..... but i believe there r also ppl will stand up n say NO.

loyal, honest and cherish is the key word in a relationship.
My advise to the ppl here.. if u have a relationship, family please protect and cherish them.... your one second decision will change a lot of ppl life....

[fallen11]

Seen many decent women married "cheongsters".
during dating already go special service.
wedding month meet fiance, come late 2h because still stuck in special service.
But still marry them anyway.
Whereas i see many decent guys out there dont get decent girls.

i would say its no one's fault. Just pure bad luck.
Not every marriage is gonna turn out fine.
Not everything will be fine in life.
Ups and downs are normal. This is life.

And u are not the only person who have suffered.
Probably even more people out there suffer fates worse than u had.
Just think how worse it could have been and how fortunate u already are in your case of misfortune.

[sexcision]

There’s a Chinese saying:男人不坏，女人不爱。女人太乖，不精彩。
A very common phase but is ruthlessly true.

[EtherC]

What to do, we are visual animals.

Most of us have only eyes for the beautiful covers.

Its like how Mazda RX8 caught our collective breath with its sleek design and curves when it first appeared in X-Men. Many young men bought it thinking they found true love only to realize that the rotary engine is a bitch to content with.

How many Mazda RX8s do you see on the roads now?


End of the day we need to realize this: Marriage is a social construct , its not the mating system Nature put in place. How is saying a few words, signing a piece of paper, putting a ring on a finger etc likely to change a person's predisposition towards sex.

There’s a Chinese saying:男人不坏，女人不爱。女人太乖，不精彩。
A very common phase but is ruthlessly true.

[Jay Chou]

What to do, we are visual animals.

Most of us have only eyes for the beautiful covers.

Its like how Mazda RX8 caught our collective breath with its sleek design and curves when it first appeared in X-Men. Many young men bought it thinking they found true love only to realize that the rotary engine is a bitch to content with.

How many Mazda RX8s do you see on the roads now?


End of the day we need to realize this: Marriage is a social construct , its not the mating system Nature put in place. How is saying a few words, signing a piece of paper, putting a ring on a finger etc likely to change a person's predisposition towards sex.

Up u Ether C. 😊

[JacqueMerlin]

Just to share.....

Honestly speaking, i dont have very good impression on this web or rather, i hate this forum. This is the place i know tat my husband went special service and prostitution, Even till to date.. But after seriously browsing this site, i have started to change abit. There r still some ppl out there.....

We have been married for many many years. In the first year of marriage i realised tat he went to special sevice.
Everytime i confronted him and promised he will changed and went there due to his workstress. With his promised, i have forgave him again again and again. During the first confront, i should stand firm to leave him. Then my 2 cutie will not suffer from their parents....

This year things happen again early this year... And this time round is the worst. He even lended out our 5 digit saving to a woman he dun even know. The words he is using is impulsive. Impulsive to find woman, impulsive to lend out the money.... I went into suicide depression.... went to see doc and i have managed to stand up by myself in months. I have been thinking where i have done wrong to make him do all this.... even till to date... u all must be thinking...... cos i have not give enough to him.... i can only tell say this when a wife request a hug, the husband asked her to hug other ppl.....

All this while, I have asked he if he has done HIV test. answer is no..... have been asking him to go but he is finding excuse....

I have been thinking for my 2 kids before i take decision to leave him. Yes this time round im very firm to leave him and will bring up my 2 kids alone....

The hurting part is the betrayal. Can man accept wife to play around? I know some of the ppl will say why not..... but i believe there r also ppl will stand up n say NO.

loyal, honest and cherish is the key word in a relationship.
My advise to the ppl here.. if u have a relationship, family please protect and cherish them.... your one second decision will change a lot of ppl life....

My ex wife...
1. Had many affairs because she thinks it is her right even after marriage
2. Kept her options open despite after our marriage.
3. Tried to divorce me a few times when she found a man who 'loves' her and yet wanted me to pay get 75% of my income as maintenance because i need to compensate her youth.
4. None of her attempts divorce became reality because that man dumped her. So she always return to me like I'm her contingency.
5. No sex in our marriage because she thinks I'm not worth it. But sex with other men are ok because they are good men.
6. I work hard and provide for her Because i see this a duty i need to fulfil. Until i can't take it anymore.
7. I contemplated suicide many times until one day I really wanted to do it. Sat by the road side crying and there was this guy who came to me trying to console me.
8. He introduced me to sammyboyforum. That was about 9 years ago. This kept me sane for a few years until we managed to divorce her finally when she found a new man.

This forum is a double edged sword depending how you use it.

[fion.18]

This forum is a double edged sword depending how you use it.

everything in life is a double edged sword, it’s how and what u do with it that makes it worth while. Glad to hear you managed to move on from your toxic marriage. jiayou!

[Indigoflashed]

To restore some faith in humanity, I think things are working out between the 2 of us. It almost feels like things were good again, albeit the occasional moments. It isn’t perfect, but I feel like I understand her better now and on a level which was deeper than before.

To all who are going through the same thing, hang in there! Internal peace is probably the hardest to obtain during this time, and I won’t say I have fully achieved it but I am happy to share my experiences with whoever wants it.

And to those who offered their listening ear to me, you know who you are. Thank you for aiding me through this.

[fallen11]

To restore some faith in humanity, I think things are working out between the 2 of us. It almost feels like things were good again, albeit the occasional moments. It isn’t perfect, but I feel like I understand her better now and on a level which was deeper than before.

To all who are going through the same thing, hang in there! Internal peace is probably the hardest to obtain during this time, and I won’t say I have fully achieved it but I am happy to share my experiences with whoever wants it.

And to those who offered their listening ear to me, you know who you are. Thank you for aiding me through this.

Just hope the best for u.

Now thats one less competitor to worry about :D

[ChokDeeDee!]

...I became super paranoid, so much so that I would follow her just to see if she was lying to me. I checked her phone, something I never used to do before. When she learnt about these she changed her passwords, and stopped me basically from snooping on her privacy....

...I paid for her education, the car, the house, the renovation, most of our outings, and I never asked her to do a job against her wishes. She practically didn’t have to worry about anything financially....

...I want to believe her, but she is making it so difficult by constantly changing her passwords and denying me the chance to validate her words...

Based on what you've posted, you're a good guy making all the financial heavylifting in the family, nothing wrong with that. There has to be something else in the relationship pushing her over the edge, to jump into a relationship with another man. Hate to say this, but you've probably lost her for good.

Invading her privacy just makes matters worst. She is going to detest you more, regardless whether she is genuinely truthful or hiding something. You mentioned that you've changed, becoming more paranoid. That does you no good and neither does it for your future relationships. The relationship has already broken down, without trust and respect for each other. It might be possible to reconcile, but it'll never be the same. You might be better off leaving this relationship behind and moving on, to recover emotionally to who you really are.

To restore some faith in humanity, I think things are working out between the 2 of us. It almost feels like things were good again, albeit the occasional moments. It isn’t perfect, but I feel like I understand her better now and on a level which was deeper than before.

To all who are going through the same thing, hang in there! Internal peace is probably the hardest to obtain during this time, and I won’t say I have fully achieved it but I am happy to share my experiences with whoever wants it.

And to those who offered their listening ear to me, you know who you are. Thank you for aiding me through this.

Getting rid of the paranoid behavior is part of the process of finding inner peace, coming to terms with the situation. Its a tough journey, but I wish you the best.

[ChokDeeDee!]

What to do, we are visual animals.
Most of us have only eyes for the beautiful covers.


Centuries of evolution and nothing has changed, its a basic instinct deeply rooted within us. All that can be done is to always "dine out", and never ask for "delivery". Whatever happens outside stays outside, public property. Draw a clear line between love and lust.

[Yihok77]

My ex wife...
1. Had many affairs because she thinks it is her right even after marriage
2. Kept her options open despite after our marriage.
3. Tried to divorce me a few times when she found a man who 'loves' her and yet wanted me to pay get 75% of my income as maintenance because i need to compensate her youth.
4. None of her attempts divorce became reality because that man dumped her. So she always return to me like I'm her contingency.
5. No sex in our marriage because she thinks I'm not worth it. But sex with other men are ok because they are good men.
6. I work hard and provide for her Because i see this a duty i need to fulfil. Until i can't take it anymore.
7. I contemplated suicide many times until one day I really wanted to do it. Sat by the road side crying and there was this guy who came to me trying to console me.
8. He introduced me to sammyboyforum. That was about 9 years ago. This kept me sane for a few years until we managed to divorce her finally when she found a new man.

This forum is a double edged sword depending how you use it.

Number 3 is bull shit. She found other man wanted divorce and want 75% income more fierce than ahlong

[JacqueMerlin]

Number 3 is bull shit. She found other man wanted divorce and want 75% income more fierce than ahlong

Like it or not. It happened. She made the demand and expected my compliance.

[fallen11]

Number 3 is bull shit. She found other man wanted divorce and want 75% income more fierce than ahlong

Very common these days.
Dont say 75%, many of them even got cheek to ask for 120% of your everything. Expect u to cough out more than whatever u have.

[leakypipes]

TS, wish you all the best. Sad and I sympathise with you.

[peanodood1337]

Just to share.....

Honestly speaking, i dont have very good impression on this web or rather, i hate this forum. This is the place i know tat my husband went special service and prostitution, Even till to date.. But after seriously browsing this site, i have started to change abit. There r still some ppl out there.....

We have been married for many many years. In the first year of marriage i realised tat he went to special sevice.
Everytime i confronted him and promised he will changed and went there due to his workstress. With his promised, i have forgave him again again and again. During the first confront, i should stand firm to leave him. Then my 2 cutie will not suffer from their parents....

This year things happen again early this year... And this time round is the worst. He even lended out our 5 digit saving to a woman he dun even know. The words he is using is impulsive. Impulsive to find woman, impulsive to lend out the money.... I went into suicide depression.... went to see doc and i have managed to stand up by myself in months. I have been thinking where i have done wrong to make him do all this.... even till to date... u all must be thinking...... cos i have not give enough to him.... i can only tell say this when a wife request a hug, the husband asked her to hug other ppl.....

All this while, I have asked he if he has done HIV test. answer is no..... have been asking him to go but he is finding excuse....

I have been thinking for my 2 kids before i take decision to leave him. Yes this time round im very firm to leave him and will bring up my 2 kids alone....

The hurting part is the betrayal. Can man accept wife to play around? I know some of the ppl will say why not..... but i believe there r also ppl will stand up n say NO.

loyal, honest and cherish is the key word in a relationship.
My advise to the ppl here.. if u have a relationship, family please protect and cherish them.... your one second decision will change a lot of ppl life....

Would you punish a knife used to kill a person, or would you punish the murderer who used the knife to kill a person?

A knife can be use to kill a person. A knife can also be used for cooking.

Likewise for this forum.

It is not easy being a single parent, but based on his actions, you've made the right decision to leave your ex.

Good luck out there.

[heye]

Been there done that.

I’m 30. Already have kids. Taking care alone. I been thru far worst than u. If u need somebody to talk. To drink. To chill do let me know. Sometimes talking out with someone who has the same plight or worst than u helps.

I may still be recovering after so many years. But I garauntee u that time heals. It’s been 4-5 years and I’m still healing.

The reason I’m still single is not that I’m ugly. But I have lost faith in marriage. Or any kind of relationships. I focus my life on my kids daily and spent as much quality time with them as possible. It all happens only during honeymoon period where is the sweetest and then it’s gone forever.


Talk to me. Let me help u. U can pm me.

Been there too bros... all the lies is just to hide her shame... same situation that they will keep on contacting each other but will be harder to catch they can msg via fb line watsapp etc and delete off the msg... create 1 more dummy fb acct.
It will be harder to catch each time u find out as there will also be other plans... take mc to meet up , lunch quickie etc.....
When trust is break and all these sluts wanna fuck ard theyhave 101 reason to blame u.
I went conseullin and the coseuller told me nt to put in too much hope but she doesnt reveal wat she told her.
2nd ting is when i mental fuck her the reason she doesnt wan divorce b coz she knws i will tc of the family


Focus on ur carrer and be strong ... i lost my biz and job bcoz i cant get over it.
Blame ourselves for choosin a wrong partner and move on. Time can heal or time can let u gt use to the pain

[JacqueMerlin]

Number 3 is bull shit. She found other man wanted divorce and want 75% income more fierce than ahlong

It happened.

[I Love Boobs]

I'm glad I divorced my Wife.
Happy being single but the loneliness can be biting...
I see my colleagues who are married, and their relationships are toxic.
Their wives have them by the balls and are spending every single dollar going on expensive overseas holidays...
Most of these wives find an excuse not to work after marriage...
I've tried dating local SG Chinese after breaking up with my white GF last year...
The results have not been pretty.
Even 34 year old girls with extra pounds play hard to get.
28 year old sales reps in dead end jobs also are conceited and self-centred.
And the leggy 20 year old I dated recently? Well, she has a bf! She was just shopping, looking to upgrade to something better..

[JacqueMerlin]

I'm glad I divorced my Wife.
Happy being single but the loneliness can be biting...
I see my colleagues who are married, and their relationships are toxic.
Their wives have them by the balls and are spending every single dollar going on expensive overseas holidays...
Most of these wives find an excuse not to work after marriage...
I've tried dating local SG Chinese after breaking up with my white GF last year...
The results have not been pretty.
Even 34 year old girls with extra pounds play hard to get.
28 year old sales reps in dead end jobs also are conceited and self-centred.
And the leggy 20 year old I dated recently? Well, she has a bf! She was just shopping, looking to upgrade to something better..

All local sg girls?

[I Love Boobs]

All local sg girls?

Also Malaysian Chinese

[jameschong1]

Also Malaysian Chinese

my friend kena jialat jialat from one china girl
he lose everything - wife, flat, money, job, friends & almost his life
lucky he listen to my advise - he survive & become stronger & smarter
now he listen to me like i m master

[I Love Boobs]

If you wanna go with a girl, make sure she's hot as fuck and is a good screw...
Because even fat and ugly girls can betray you...