Rumoured Raids

[clowny]

Hi,

was at a KTV on friday and around 10+ the gals started getting calls
and their friends told them there was a raid ..
so the rumour spread and eventually 1130pm all the gals left. :mad:
it seems all the raid fear has made all the gals paranoid ? ?
and i also read about the previous post on TH ktv gals getting warnings

i was caught in such a scenario for around 5 times but
evenutally no cops showed up. so wondering is this just the gals' tactics to collect tips and go home early or go for other kangtaos ? :confused:

there was also once where most of the gals left except for a few who continued to work, the gals who stayed also said something which is VERY true, if the police want to catch you, THERE is no WAY you can escape , letting alone let u recieve warning etc.

i guess this is not new to people out there.
but just wondering since anti vice is out to catch FLs,
why would the KTV gals be affected since they are not standing on streets ?
it should be the ICA to catch them for working illegially ?

any bros out there who got such experiences or share more ?

[soba006]

yah... bro, i can understand how u feeling. i was also in the same situation 2 weeks ago in one of the ktv at GL...Boring....:(

[Carebear]

i was caught in such a scenario for around 5 times but evenutally no cops showed up. so wondering is this just the gals' tactics to collect tips and go home early or go for other kangtaos ? :confused:

Guys also can call and warned gals got raid then the gals will go out with them since cannot work. When one gal receive wind, it will blow.:confused:

[Green Goblin]

Cannot really blame the girls for running scared. Have been through many such incidents in JC. :cool:

[kthan10]

Wat time do they conduct raids usually? Cos i scared i kanna when i am at HC for services... esp chinatown area

[Peggie83]

Last thursday night there is also raid at Joo Chiat Bunker & Blue Lagoon areas.

Police cars & vans parked outside those pubs. They conducted a 100% inspection inside Blue Lagoon at 11pm before police come most viet gals already run far far either got men drive them or they (viets) take taxis & run.

:confused: :confused:

[Ronsee]

Its understandable why all these FLs run even when they are working inside KTVs or pubs. According to my understanding, it is an offence for these girls who are on SVPs to be working here in Singapore.

The anti-vice have a right to catch them and send them back if they are arrested in such places.

This applies to all types of girls from any country. I have seen and been in numerous situations when anti-vice police stormed Orchard Towers and the girl who was sitting with me got taken away right under my nose. Nothing i could really do about it though.

They come in and block off the entrance and ask all the men to stay one side and girls other side. And 1 by 1 they check all the girls for their passports and those without VISAs or passport are immediately handcuffed and brought out. Those who had valid visas were asked why they were there and who they were with. If no satisfactory answer is given they will also be taken back and deported and banned from coming to Singapore for a few years.

I had a close friend who had a regular FL Viet girl from Joo Chiat who got caught at her hotel at Bencoolen street. Even though she had a valid 1 month VISA, the police still detained her for for 2 days and deported her back and banned her from Singapore for 3 years.

How sad...

Just my 2 cents.

[newbadass]

i was caught in such a scenario for around 5 times but
evenutally no cops showed up. so wondering is this just the gals' tactics to collect tips and go home early or go for other kangtaos ? :confused:

Could be. If you think she didn't do enough to warrant a tip, then don't tip. If she was scared enough to be running, she wouldn't stick around pestering for a tip she didn't earn anyway.

If she wants tips, she stays. Very simple. Kenna caught also not your problem.

Of course, I wouldn't do this to my regulars. But my regulars probably wouldn't pull this stunt on me either.

[Castrol]

was at a KTV on friday and around 10+ the gals started getting calls
and their friends told them there was a raid ..
so the rumour spread and eventually 1130pm all the gals left.

well if all the chicks leave then i dont think they are playing games otherwise the ktv bosses also headache. but you kanna 5 times is a lot, you must have cheong those black listed ktvs.

i would prefer that way actually, all of them run so at least we dont pay or just pay small tips and leave the bottle for another day. they got no time to argue why tips so little mah, anyway hey, our night there is also screwed.

if and when the garberment people really come to switch on lights, its no fun. you cannot leave, cannot sing song, go toilet also must ask permission. and sometimes they will frisk you if they "suspect" you got something on you. :D

[WillamSexsphere]

Its understandable why all these FLs run even when they are working inside KTVs or pubs. According to my understanding, it is an offence for these girls who are on SVPs to be working here in Singapore.

The anti-vice have a right to catch them and send them back if they are arrested in such places.

This applies to all types of girls from any country. I have seen and been in numerous situations when anti-vice police stormed Orchard Towers and the girl who was sitting with me got taken away right under my nose. Nothing i could really do about it though.

They come in and block off the entrance and ask all the men to stay one side and girls other side. And 1 by 1 they check all the girls for their passports and those without VISAs or passport are immediately handcuffed and brought out. Those who had valid visas were asked why they were there and who they were with. If no satisfactory answer is given they will also be taken back and deported and banned from coming to Singapore for a few years.

I had a close friend who had a regular FL Viet girl from Joo Chiat who got caught at her hotel at Bencoolen street. Even though she had a valid 1 month VISA, the police still detained her for for 2 days and deported her back and banned her from Singapore for 3 years.

How sad...

Just my 2 cents.


Before the Aume case, we had assumed that it was the law. But the judiciary, the check and balance of Legislative and the Executive, deffered the deportation of the girl back to the MHA - because our constitution did not give such authority to MHA, unless in terrorism cases!

While we greatly admire the efficiency of MHA and have our fullest cooperation with their activities, there is a line where abuses of power may be unwittingly crossed. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Where will the line be drawn, if it is not drawn? We understand and support that line where terrorism is involve, but vice?

Can the authorities prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the lady they apprehended is involve in vice activities? Was she caught in the act of solicitating or just hearsay? As long as they are on SVP, they are tourists and tourism contributes to our GNP as well as GDP. Some of the tourists i know do not engage in sexual activities, even paid ones.

Deportation of suspected terrorists is greatly applauded. But today, deportation of tourists suspect only of vice activity, tomorrow what else? suspected having chewing gum?

Are we going to offend tourists just because MHA SUSPECT, without proof, that a tourist is involve in vice activities? Who will come and spend money on our shores? Who will comfort our men? Are we prepared to lose Singdollars should our men goes overseas to look for comfort?

We understand too the concern of sexual diseases, but with the compulsory use of condoms and protected sex, it is relatively safer than unprotected sex. It is under controlled. Furthermore, sex is a natural urge amongst humans. If denied of commercial sex, think what will happen to other women. Look at Kedah, province of sterile sex, and you will understand what would happen.

Consider too that the foriegn women are not only to blame if diseases are a concern. Consider too the foriegn men as well! Our local women, singles as well some married ones (whom our hardworking singapore men have no time or too stress out with modern living, fighting for survival of spore in the economic world, to care), are going to them for sex too. Are these women apprehended too?

We are proud to be Singaporeans, for we live in land ruled by law. And we are the ones who made and agreed to the law through our national representatives. We do not live in a banana republic, where the police have unlimited powers. Therefore we are not afraid to voice out when the line is crossed without authority and will seek a thorough explanation. As mentioned, we support MHA and its staff, for they are us, singaporeans too, but we are a lawful state, best to do it and follow the law, otherwise there will be chaos, - one law for all, and not for some only.

cheers!:)

[sudsoz]

My understanding is that the visa these girls get are short term entry visas - effectively a tourist visa that does not allow them to work or study.

Now in a KTV it would be pretty clear that the girl is violating the terms of the visa - although very occasionally there are female customers. But what makes one of these girls on a tourist visa in a pub or disco such as at Orchard Towers or Paramount or Joo Chiat any different to the other tourist patrons?

I may be naive but would you not expect a twenty-something year old tourist to be out partying at a disco or pub? I suppose at a BmD bar the drink records might be a problem but not for a FL girl.

I am just wondering how the poooolice strike a link between the girls being in a bar and being 'on the job'.

[newbadass]

I am just wondering how the poooolice strike a link between the girls being in a bar and being 'on the job'.

Just one word: Receipt :D

[KLKOOL]

Just one word: Receipt :D

Wah... the girl can issue receipt ??? Like that good leh. Entertain can claim :D

[Ronsee]

Wah... the girl can issue receipt ??? Like that good leh. Entertain can claim :D

I think the bro meant that the girl had a valid receipt for drinks she ordered at the pub or disco to prove to the police that she was there to cheong and not to FL for business.

Cheers :)

[KLKOOL]

I think the bro meant that the girl had a valid receipt for drinks she ordered at the pub or disco to prove to the police that she was there to cheong and not to FL for business.

Cheers :)

But guys can buy the gal drinks mah... :confused:

[evilspawnsss]

Receipt no name de mah hahaa..u buy liao give the girl lor..scarely the police wan scan u..u no receipt?suspect u doing FL for girls here hee hee :D jus joking

[sudsoz]

I think the bro meant that the girl had a valid receipt for drinks she ordered at the pub or disco to prove to the police that she was there to cheong and not to FL for business.

Cheers :)

Any bar, any town anywhere in the world. How often does a lady have to buy her own drink? Come to think of it a working lady probably buys her own drinks more often than an amateur.

Seriously - I don't see how whether she bought a drink or not provides any sort of proof of her intent.

Bill Sexphere seems to be a local getting to the point. I am merely a frequent visitor trying to understand.

[clowny]

Could be. If you think she didn't do enough to warrant a tip, then don't tip. If she was scared enough to be running, she wouldn't stick around pestering for a tip she didn't earn anyway.

If she wants tips, she stays. Very simple. Kenna caught also not your problem.

Of course, I wouldn't do this to my regulars. But my regulars probably wouldn't pull this stunt on me either.

thats what i thought but they keep staying until they get the tips...
and the correct amount. at least $20 at 1030 , not even half the time.
they will pester if u try to give them $10 - $15

[clowny]

well if all the chicks leave then i dont think they are playing games otherwise the ktv bosses also headache. but you kanna 5 times is a lot, you must have cheong those black listed ktvs.

i would prefer that way actually, all of them run so at least we dont pay or just pay small tips and leave the bottle for another day. they got no time to argue why tips so little mah, anyway hey, our night there is also screwed.

if and when the garberment people really come to switch on lights, its no fun. you cannot leave, cannot sing song, go toilet also must ask permission. and sometimes they will frisk you if they "suspect" you got something on you. :D

only the one last week still got some gals staying behind, so does that mean the gals are playing tricks or they got better lobang until their agents being them to another place. . haha

one reason i called them rumoured raids is coz ... 5 times , no police come..
must see ghost then afraid ma.. " touch wood"

normally i go for beer la, leave bottle bo hua ma ?
not really a regular at any specific KTV . always run about..
coz normally try BS and NSH .. no slots ... then walk up along GL and
search for any FREE space lor.

and WHEN i get slots for BS or NSH,
as if the cheongsters all know about raids ... they dun come..
so i got the slot... kanna 2 out of 4 times there liao ..

went BS and when the gals heard about rumoured raids ...
the guys flood the toilet ... come out after 30 mins .. u can save alot :)

[Ronsee]

But guys can buy the gal drinks mah... :confused:

Yes bro u r right on that. But i think the best way to prove to anti-vice police that the girls arent WL is when they have the capability to buy their own drinks....means they got $ and is not there soliciting business.

Just my 2 cents :)

[newbadass]

Any bar, any town anywhere in the world. How often does a lady have to buy her own drink? Come to think of it a working lady probably buys her own drinks more often than an amateur.

Seriously - I don't see how whether she bought a drink or not provides any sort of proof of her intent.


Edit: Not worth explaining.

[laodi123456789]

Please note that National Day is coming up in August. The country gets a spring cleaning for the festivities. Its good to remain veri low profile until celebrations are over.

[tanterry]

and WHEN i get slots for BS or NSH,
as if the cheongsters all know about raids ... they dun come..
so i got the slot... kanna 2 out of 4 times there liao ..



Only thing in our mind is not want to sing song in the room alone wat, so will sms those regular gals before going down ;)

[clowny]

Only thing in our mind is not want to sing song in the room alone wat, so will sms those regular gals before going down ;)

thing is i dun have any regular gals there ma..
u share some kang tao with me lor :)

[WillamSexsphere]

I was wondering, why do you guys allow the raids to continue so often?

Pubs/KTVs are legitimate business just like any other. They employ people, provide an entertainment service, pay their taxes, contribute to GDP and are allowed little or no inteference from the authorities so long as they do not flout any rules laid down.

Patronising pubs by locals, tourists or foriegners is not a criminal offence, so long as the patrons do not create any problems to others such as drug taking, rioting, etc.

MHA depts are fully authorised by the Legislative to conduct spot checks ( politically correct term for 'raids') on pubs/ktvs once in a while to ensure they keep to the rules.

The problem arises when these 'spot checks' becomes too regular that the stressed out singaporean who have to work hard on the economic, military front as well as caring for the family, decides to take a break, finds himself even more stress out by such raids.

Imagine you are relaxing with friends and company over a beer in a conducieve environment and then suddenly MHA dept groups storms into the pub, turning on all lights, shutting off the music, do not allow us to touch our handphones or take calls, telling us to remain in our seats, no one to move or leave the pub, like as if we are a bunch of criminals.

Next they will order the ladies, irregardless if she was brought in to the pub by you from work or a tourist visiting the pub, to queue up on an empty side of the bar, to shut up, not to make any noise and to produce their ICs/passports. I saw a girl who was only a tourist and first time visiting the pub got so frightened by the plainclothes authorities that she ran towards the door, but a burly officer reached out, pulled and drag her by her hair back to the queue. ( i only saw it happen once, though the few times i saw raids, the officers were more gentlemanly, espacially recently)

Then they will look at us guys and if our faces were ugly, they will ask us to produce and take away our ICs to check.

All these takes time and usually more than half an hour to an hour. If you just got there to take a breather and happen to chance upon a raid, which is more often lately - 2 to 3 times a week on the same location, there goes your happy hour. Guess you arent allowed to be happy, just work and work for the nation and the family with no free time for yourself.

We can understand that MHA has a role to play, and can even understand that they are used and manipulated by hypocrite landowners who use them to do the dirty job of clearing the pubs away so that their properties will fetch a better price ( notice how these hypocrites do not offer constructive suggestions on help men's natural urges in our land scarce nation or offer ways to assist foriegners earn legitimate money except to always bleat 'get out of my territory' - shows distinctively their hypocrisy and selfish greed)

What we cannot understand is why the need for raids SO OFTEN. Are they based on just 'suspicion' alone and hearsay, justifiable enough to interupt businesses and tax paying customers quiet enjoyment?

And what are these raids suppose to find out?

1. Solicitation
Solicitation is a criminal offence but it needs to be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, not just on hearsay alone. Does MHA hopes to strike it lucky, burst into a pub just in time to hear a prostitute solicitate a customer? If not, such constant raid becomes outright cases of persecution and denial of freedom to owners as well as customers and becomes questionable abuse of authority, which i hope it's not the case.

2. Is tipping or giving away money a crime by the reciever?
If so, then MHA best put all in the service and tourist industry including CEOS and those who seek donations behind bars as well.

3. Illegal aliens
Illegal aliens do not just appear only in pubs, but all over the nation as well. Would MHA storm into a shopping centre ( where there are more) or a corporate office building in shenton way to conduct their checks?

We do support MHA efforts and will fully cooperate with them, but is there a better and more efficient way to conduct checks on illegal aliens other than to storm into a pub and break everyone's quiet enjoyment? Why not conduct spot checks outside of establishments instead of inside? Owners conducting legitimate business and taxpaying citizens should not be bearing the brunt of having their off time disrupted based on soely suspicion, hearsay or manipulation of others.

Perhaps it's time to have a talk with our elected representatives to seek their counsel and advice.



.

[clowny]

if things are going to carry on, imagine what will happen when the IR arrive.
tourist will get sick easily ..

dear brothers IR is our next hope of more entertainment..

[sudsoz]

Pubs/KTVs are legitimate business just like any other. They employ people, provide an entertainment service, pay their taxes, contribute to GDP and are allowed little or no inteference from the authorities so long as they do not flout any rules laid down.

Patronising pubs by locals, tourists or foriegners is not a criminal offence, so long as the patrons do not create any problems to others such as drug taking, rioting, etc.

.

Well said - there is a lot of logic here. But authoritarian control was never logical.

[aronkee]

Well said - there is a lot of logic here. But authoritarian control was never logical.

we dun agree with authoritarian control but in spore, pretty much left with no choice coz thats the sad fact of singapore..

[Ronsee]

From what i observed, the anti-vice do not conduct raids in every night entertainment location.

They only conduct regular checks in night spots which already have a reputation for sleazy activities.

Thats why places like Boat/ Clark Quays, Mohammed Sultan, Paramount Hotel, OT, Joo Chiat and even geylang have seen alot of such police (Anti-Vice) activities.

However for places like Zouk, MOS etc from all the times i have been there, i have hardly even hear of anti-vice going in these places and doing ad-hoc checks on the patrons of these places.

So i guess not all night spots area will get the raids by anti-vice unless the locality has already got a bad reputation or someone logdes complains to the authorities or ministers (like in the case of Joo Chiats' Vietnamese Pubs).

Just my 2 cents

[newbadass]

I was wondering, why do you guys allow the raids to continue so often?

Because we can't do anything about it. We are powerless to prevent them from doing their job. And we don't have enough motivation to do it. That is my frankest and most brutal assessment of the situation.

Talk so big, talk so long, logic machiam like poetry, and at the end of the day, are we going to do anything? Can we do anything? Would we do it even if we could?

Big fat NO.

All talk. That's the Singaporean lifestyle today. :D

[Rof|maoxz]

I was wondering, why do you guys allow the raids to continue so often?

Perhaps it's time to have a talk with our elected representatives to seek their counsel and advice..

Don't blame the guys,
Don't blame the drinks,
Don't blame the hot pipped music,

No gers, No hanky panky, No Raid..... Simple. :D

[TCSG]

Because we can't do anything about it. We are powerless to prevent them from doing their job. And we don't have enough motivation to do it. That is my frankest and most brutal assessment of the situation.
Talk so big, talk so long, logic machiam like poetry, and at the end of the day, are we going to do anything? Can we do anything? Would we do it even if we could?
Big fat NO.
All talk. That's the Singaporean lifestyle today. :D
dun like that lah brother.
What he said is true. We should be thanksfull that we still have people like himself who could voice out unhappiness and logic in general for everyone that are in the same position.
If we discourage him from speaking out, even if we know it is of no help, then this country will really be jialat liao.
Depend on our MP to speak on our behalf for such issues, can wait long long...

[tiger2]

dun like that lah brother.
What he said is true. We should be thanksfull that we still have people like himself who could voice out unhappiness and logic in general for everyone that are in the same position.
If we discourage him from speaking out, even if we know it is of no help, then this country will really be jialat liao.
Depend on our MP to speak on our behalf for such issues, can wait long long...
you are right bro, even their MP like Mr Tan Soo Khoon who spoke out for the public like ( ERP = EVERY ROADS PAY ) than the next instant you can see him very quiet and nothing comes out from him, why? maybe our BIG BRO LKY invite him for a coffee talk.
so in Singapore who will voice out for you.
it is Teo Chew Er Huo ( chee kay koo chee kay )....:D

[newbadass]

dun like that lah brother.
What he said is true. We should be thanksfull that we still have people like himself who could voice out unhappiness and logic in general for everyone that are in the same position..

A lot of things said in politics are true. Just depends what context you say it in and how you present it. Just because a statement is true doesn't prevent it from being a lot of useless cock.

Besides, he asked "why do you guys allow it" and I answered. Because it is not up to us whether to allow it or not, so all we can do is LPPL and KPKB like a bunch of... well, Singaporeans. :D

[Peggie83]

I believe most of us here do not want to see those WLs up the police van :)

[S3vw]

If she wants tips, she stays. Very simple. Kenna caught also not your problem.

Of course, I wouldn't do this to my regulars. But my regulars probably wouldn't pull this stunt on me either.

so only regulars is human being...:rolleyes:

[Optimus_Prime]

I believe most of us here do not want to see those WLs up the police van :)

Well there are those who believe in the advert...

"Old ones dun go, New ones dun come...":D

But they forgot to add... just so long as it's not my fav regular...keke..

[S3vw]

Please note that National Day is coming up in August. The country gets a spring cleaning for the festivities. Its good to remain veri low profile until celebrations are over.

do agreed with tat...

[fattyman]

This applies to all types of girls from any country. I have seen and been in numerous situations when anti-vice police stormed Orchard Towers and the girl who was sitting with me got taken away right under my nose. Nothing i could really do about it though.


Pls don't sensatinonalize it, firstly they were taken away to check whether their travelling docs are proper & secondly if they were to take someone away there MUST be a reason & NOT without a reason. Who knows maybe 3 hrs after the inspection they were release again.



And 1 by 1 they check all the girls for their passports and those without VISAs or passport are immediately handcuffed and brought out. Those who had valid visas were asked why they were there and who they were with. If no satisfactory answer is given they will also be taken back and deported and banned from coming to Singapore for a few years.


Again pls don't sensationalize it :mad: you can deport a person unless they commit a crime. By deporting a person for not giving a satisfactory answer to the Police i don't think they can do that to a foreigner just like that.



I had a close friend who had a regular FL Viet girl from Joo Chiat who got caught at her hotel at Bencoolen street. Even though she had a valid 1 month VISA, the police still detained her for for 2 days and deported her back and banned her from Singapore for 3 years.


Pls don't confuse & sensationalize the readers here again, though she had a valid VISA the Police charged her for soliciting a client under the Prostitution Act without a valid licence thus being deported & BANNED her from entering Sinkeepore.

They don't deport someone without a reason. :mad:

[Ronsee]

I remembered 1 recent incident not so long ago when i was in OT and there was a raid. I had 1 pinoy sitting with me when anti-vice came in and conducted an ad-hoc search.

As usual lights were turned on (could tell which WL was pretty and which CMI :D ) and the lady were all told to move to 1 side of the pub near the counter. I told my girl to sit with me and within 30 secs an officer with a badge hanging from his neck approached me and asked me if i knew the girl and how she was related to me. At this point i could see that my pinoy girl was already freaked out..so i told the officer that i met her here and bought her some drinks and we were chatting together.

Even then the Officer still asked to check the pinoys passport and asked me politely if she could leave my table and stand along with the rest of the girls...i just nodded my head knowing that there was nothing much i could do to help her. The looked she gave me when she left my table make my heart sank...i felt bad and was angry that i couldnt do anything to help her. So i mustered my courage and approached the Officer who spoke to me and i asked him what was to happened to her...he said they will just talk to her and find out if they were suspected of illegally solicting for business there and over stayers.

At that i knew that she was a goner for sure and true enough she was taken away by the police in the end for questioning.

I can understand the feelings some brothers have against such raids but i guess its already something that we will need to live with as long as we r out to cheong.

Yes these things sucks and spoils the mood but then again its also up to us to overcome this and carry on with our night activities.

I know its easy to type it out....doing it is another thing though.

Just my 2 cents

[cjps]

As usual lights were turned on (could tell which WL was pretty and which CMI :D ) and the lady were all told to move to 1 side of the pub near the counter. I told my girl to sit with me and within 30 secs an officer with a badge hanging from his neck approached me and asked me if i knew the girl and how she was related to me. At this point i could see that my pinoy girl was already freaked out..so i told the officer that i met her here and bought her some drinks and we were chatting together.
Brother must salute you. I once witness a RAID in TH and 1 of the cheongster doing same thing as you asking the girl to sit by his side kana up the van also.
The police officer then was not so nice.

[Ronsee]

Bro i dont think its anything wrong for us to be sitting with these WLs or FLs in the pubs when the raids are conducted. I dont see any reason why the police would ask me to go to the police station unless i got overly aggressive with the police officer.

Thats why its always good to be polite when talking to them and dont push our luck.

Honestly its not worth the trouble to get involved with the police over a working girl and then spoil our evening at the police station.

I believe the most we can do is to try to get some information from the police officer and then let the girl go if we know theres nothing much we can do to help them.

Just my 2 cents

[WillamSexsphere]

Because we can't do anything about it. We are powerless to prevent them from doing their job. And we don't have enough motivation to do it. That is my frankest and most brutal assessment of the situation.

Talk so big, talk so long, logic machiam like poetry, and at the end of the day, are we going to do anything? Can we do anything? Would we do it even if we could?

Big fat NO.

All talk. That's the Singaporean lifestyle today. :D

I can understand the vitrol directed against my post, but i failed to understand the author's vitrol against other singaporeans as well as his fatalistic outlook.

Very often, foreigners describe singaporeans as politically apathetic and understandably true. When discussions moved into the realm of politics, I too have a fear and not without valid reason.

We had been socially engineered since our birth to live for the collective good, a democracy different from others whereby the majority rule through a concensus amongst its legislative and the executive. We do have freedom, but it comes with a responsibility for the consideration of others.

And who created and agreed to such constitution? None other than us, for without us and our agreement to mutual social obligations, represented by our elected officials to parliament, Spore would not had been a success story and would have been long swallowed by our rapacious and envious neighbours.

The thing is, if our displeasure is voiced within upheld laws on freedom of speech, and not even within a mile close to the 'out of bounds' markers set up by the authorities, why fear to speak out decisively on our collective displeasure?

Instead of directing his frustrations at my post, should not he, who claimed to a fellow brother cheongster and equally upset with the constant raids, contribute something more worthy to let the authorities, who may had overlook it's staff zealousness or manipulation by greedy hypocrites, to see further into our displeasure?

Why fight against one another and be divided instead of uniting in a more conduceive manner and explore constructive ways to solve our brothers' predicament through a simple open discussion, of a situation that is NON-POLITICAL anyway but just a concern about the civil service and the doings of our fellow singaporeans civil servants who had disrupted our quiet enjoyment constantly as well as their treatment of certain female tourists on our island?

It is my fervant hope that he do not assume that just because he adopts a fatalistic approach and do not wish to do anything about the situation, generalize that everyone thinks like him. Read up on the Amue Athu case. Now that's a brave and courageous Singaporean.

For once, it is my plea that the author uses his bigger head to reflect on the phrase ' The pen is mightier than the sword'. Swords may subjugate others and aquire territories, but it is the logically and rationalised spoken or written words that conquers the hearts and minds of mankind since the dawn of civilisation from a barbaric existance.

If he is still not aware, then let it be known to him that not only cheongsters come to SBF. There are 'others' too.

Hope for a change begins with a word from the mind. If the majority does not think alike, then such hope of change dies off like a lazy afternoon's breeze. However, should the majority think and feels alike, such wind gathers into a storm and reacts with a force of a hurricane.

Better a directed storm into a teacup than an uncontrollable hurricane fury.


Cheers!:)

[newbadass]

so only regulars is human being...:rolleyes:

Wah, all the smart people coming out.

[S3vw]

Wah, all the smart people coming out.

nvr proclaim i am one....

[newbadass]

I can understand the vitrol directed against my post, but i failed to understand the author's vitrol against other singaporeans as well as his fatalistic outlook.


If your long post is meant to impress anyone, maybe you should learn how to properly apply fancy words like "vitriol" and how to spell them properly. Just a polite suggestion.

And I am stating a fact. As Singaporeans, all we do is talk. A lot. You just made my point for me. Many times.

It is my fervant hope that he do not assume that just because he adopts a fatalistic approach and do not wish to do anything about the situation, generalize that everyone thinks like him.


It is also my fervent hope that the author not assume certain things as well. Frankly, I don't feel one way or other about raids. They spoil my fun, but there's another day. So please don't assume that raids upset me, because they don't.

I do not assume that nobody wants to do anything about the situation. I KNOW. Because if we really wanted to do something, we would be out there doing it instead of talking a lot of cock here. Posts like yours, mine, even this thread, would not exist.


For once, it is my plea that the author uses his bigger head to reflect on the phrase ' The pen is mightier than the sword'.


For once, it is my plea that the author use his kar chng to reflect on the phrase "chui kong lam par song". :rolleyes:

[The_Unrepentant]

For once, it is my plea that the author uses his bigger head to reflect on the phrase ' The pen is mightier than the sword'.


depends on situation leh. if pen is really mightier than sword, we don need to serve ns liao. :rolleyes:

sword and pen must go together one lah. no such thing as which is mightier. :D

[Rof|maoxz]

For once, it is my plea that the author use his kar chng to reflect on the phrase "chui kong lam par song". :rolleyes:

What does that "V" word means har? Angry arh? Tu Lan say Tu Lan lah.

Time to eat the slice fish meat mee hoon lah. :D

[sean69]

What does that "V" word means har? Angry arh?

the only "V" words i know are .. vaginal.. virgin.. :D

[newbadass]

What does that "V" word means har? Angry arh? Tu Lan say Tu Lan lah.

Time to eat the slice fish meat mee hoon lah. :D

Vitriol = sulphuric acid.
It's also used to describe criticism when it's very cutting.

Why? Are you buying the slice fish meat mee hoon? Or should I buy you a cake instead? :D

[Rof|maoxz]

Vitriol = sulphuric acid.
It's also used to describe criticism when it's very cutting.

Why? Are you buying the slice fish meat mee hoon? Or should I buy you a cake instead? :D

Aiyah mai say you lah.... 10 invites 9 invites, always say busy busy..... you and my cousin dun go so close hor..... later.... :D

[KLKOOL]

Why? Are you buying the slice fish meat mee hoon? Or should I buy you a cake instead? :D

Wah... snake nowadays have very diverse diet horr ?? what happen to field mice and rats :p

[sudsoz]

they were taken away to check whether their travelling docs are proper & secondly if they were to take someone away there MUST be a reason & NOT without a reason. Who knows maybe 3 hrs after the inspection they were release again.

Again pls don't sensationalize it :mad: you can deport a person unless they commit a crime. By deporting a person for not giving a satisfactory answer to the Police i don't think they can do that to a foreigner just like that.

Pls don't confuse & sensationalize the readers here again, though she had a valid VISA the Police charged her for soliciting a client under the Prostitution Act without a valid licence thus being deported & BANNED her from entering Sinkeepore.

They don't deport someone without a reason. :mad:


I still don't see how the police get evidence to charge one of these girls with soliciting - unless they subject them to a cruel and prolonged interrogation that produces a 'confession'.

If they have a valid visa that they have not overstayed why are they not allowed to be out in a bar or disco or whatever. Going to the bar, talking to the people in the bar or even allowing a guy in the bar to buy her a drink does not amount to soliciting.

Many times when I have picked up a FL the conversation in the bar has been about her life, my life and the world around us. I have said at some point 'I'm going back to my hotel - are you coming' and that was that. Now where is that soliciting on the girls part?

There is another report from Ronsee about a girl staying seated next to him during a 'raid'. Provided her visa is valid - and that takes 30 seconds to check - what is wrong with that? They met in the bar, their eyes smiled and they are talking about life in her home town. Is that not perfectly normal activity for a tourist?

A tourist is someone who travels in order to see new places and meet new people. Many regular tourists (male and female) engage in activities that they would do at home. This includes bars and casual sex. What makes these girls so different?

Come to think of it most tourists or business travellers would not take their passport with them when they go out at night. Yet these girls are expected to carry theirs - is that not a double standard?

The way I see it the police action is valid if they find girls who have overstayed their visa or they can prove income earning activity (e.g ladydrink commissions from a bar or tips that are directly related to some kind of service) of which soliciting for prostitution is a special category.

But just finding the girl in a bar does not prove any of that.

You can write to your MP's and all the rest but don't hold your breath. The people who could have some influence is the law abiding bar owners who could complain that the raids are affecting business. But I think these raids have given them a scare factor that lets them control the girls after work activities more and that suits many of them just fine.

Sorry for the rant - could not help myself.

[Ronsee]

Pls don't sensatinonalize it, firstly they were taken away to check whether their travelling docs are proper & secondly if they were to take someone away there MUST be a reason & NOT without a reason. Who knows maybe 3 hrs after the inspection they were release again.



Again pls don't sensationalize it :mad: you can deport a person unless they commit a crime. By deporting a person for not giving a satisfactory answer to the Police i don't think they can do that to a foreigner just like that.


Pls don't confuse & sensationalize the readers here again, though she had a valid VISA the Police charged her for soliciting a client under the Prostitution Act without a valid licence thus being deported & BANNED her from entering Sinkeepore.

They don't deport someone without a reason. :mad:

Theres nothing to sensationalize about the whole issue. What i had written is based on what i had personally seen and experienced during all my years of cheonging nightspots in Sillypore.

The deporting of the viet girl (with a valid 1 month VISA) is also a real incident because my close friend (he is also a member of SBF) and her are still in contact now that she is in vietnam. U r welcome to verify this with me if u wish to confirm the truthfulness of my statement.

My many years of experiences cheonging locally and overseas have allowed me to see the dark side of many things our local/ foreign authorities have done. And i m not about to go into a debate over this with you if u feel so strongly about these issues.

Its my personal experiences that i m sharing with SBF bros here and theres no need for u to get overly critical or defensive about the whole issue.

Just my 2 cents

[clowny]

well .. think we have to agree that
the basis of all law in singapore is

"innocent unless proven guilty"

if this rule is jumble up .. singapore no law liao

so based on this .. unless you are pants down in KTV
else shouldn be any major problem :)

[fattyman]

well .. think we have to agree that
the basis of all law in singapore is

"innocent unless proven guilty"

if this rule is jumble up .. singapore no law liao

so based on this .. unless you are pants down in KTV
else shouldn be any major problem


As what you've said "unless is proven guilty" ;)

No such thing as rounded up & deport them for "not giving a satisfactory answer" to the Police or Anti-Vice force.

Hmmm, do i look like i was just borned yesteryear :p

[Ronsee]

Just another recent incident of police arrest which happened couple of weeks ago, i was with 3 bros drinking with 2 viets with us in a KTV pub near geylang L42 when most of the girls suddenly deserted the place. I asked the usher there what happened and he said police was coming.

My girl actually wanted to go off with the other girl cause their friends had all gone off but i told her to stay with me and it will be alright. In the end my bros girl left but mine stayed with me in the pub. (In the end she stayed with me the whole night :D )

Not long after 2 police officers came in (plainclothes) and looked around the pub and left after a few seconds.

Next door there was a hotel and there was some commotion going on. I went outside to take a look and saw 2 police cars parked outside the hotel (along main road) and lots of men and viet girls standing outide the hotel's main glass door looking in. I kaypoh and asked 1 of the guys standing there and he said police had gone up to hotel to arrest someone.

My point is that anti-vice are always on the move prowling our night spots and also checking on all forms of anti-vice activities.

While some bros may feel that checks disrupt our night activities but its just something that we may have to learn to live with. As for whether the police does arrest and deport girls after detaining them at night spots...its not something that we will know the answer for sure. There may be many compelling reasons for such things to happen that we do not know unless we are working for the AV.

Just move on with our activities and let the AV do what they want. Point is we are out to have a good time and just stay away from trouble.

What i can share are only those things that i have personally seen and experienced. Just take it with a pinch of salt.

Just my 2 cents.

[evilspawnsss]

Bros lets say if we happen to stay overnight at a hotel with any viet or prc girls,will they come up and knock the door and arrest us?

[sudsoz]

Bros lets say if we happen to stay overnight at a hotel with any viet or prc girls,will they come up and knock the door and arrest us?

But does it count that they find you and a girl with a visit pass in a hotel doing whatever you choose to do in private without disturbing anyone? Don't they have to find evidence of money changing hands for services rendered before they can kick her out?

[Looksee]

Bros lets say if we happen to stay overnight at a hotel with any viet or prc girls,will they come up and knock the door and arrest us?

for overnite dun stay in H81......find a better hotel....safer....

[evilspawnsss]

for overnite dun stay in H81......find a better hotel....safer....

Hmmm...ya ya thks bro :) Maybe not in geylang area?

[Looksee]

Hmmm...ya ya thks bro :) Maybe not in geylang area?

definately avoid GL and JC area lah......

u points going up quite fast hor?

[evilspawnsss]

u points going up quite fast hor?


:D hee hee ya lor Bro..thanks to u all...Now can post more,talk more liao hee hee...somemore i LIVERPOOL fans :cool:

[WillamSexsphere]

My point is that anti-vice are always on the move prowling our night spots and also checking on all forms of anti-vice activities.....While some bros may feel that checks disrupt our night activities but its just something that we may have to learn to live with..... Just move on with our activities and let the AV do what they want. Point is we are out to have a good time and just stay away from trouble.



That's a very sensible advice.

There's no question on the necessity for MHA to conduct spot checks on nightspots. Many would welcome it for it helps to get rid of the criminal elements that thrives or hopes to thrive in such environment, such as outright gambling tables, drug dealers and illegal aliens.

We categorically would support MHA efforts and would even inform them on such activities should it takes place within our eyesight, for who amongst us do not hate lives destroying addictive drugs, hustler con gamblers and desperado over-stayers?

However, questions arise when the raids become too frequent - once or twice a week on a similar spot over several nightspots. What does it hopes to achieve when there are no illegal activities conducted there, except to disrupt owners and customers quiet enjoyment, leaving a bitter taste with no hope for future co-operation from us with the authorities. Are there more efficient other ways not explored fully? Could undercover agents be used instead?

It would be easy to brush off such disruptions if one frequents nightspots infrequently, as the luck of the draw would have made him miss out on the raid itself.

But for others who need to de-stress from work for an hour or two, or some who faces only 4 lonely walls at home, nightspots are legal peaceful and interative outlets, amongst other hobbies on our limited fun activities small island.

If such outlets are frequently disrupted, then those who can afford it will only bring our precious Singdollars overseas, causing an drain on our foreign exchange treasury as well as leaving behind a large highly stressed lower income group with no outlets.

Furthermore, we had pinned our hopes on the IR projects to bring in income to our treasury, as well as attracting foreign talents to our shores. While not everyone will participate in nightspots activity, there may be enough to form a majority that will do so.

When even locals are questioning the rationale and efficiency of the frequent raids and disruption, what more will these foriegners?

IR and other national projects are funded by the authorities. And where does such funds comes from? Remember that we have no natural resources such as oil and minerals. The answer is, most of our national investments come from the various forms of taxation and mainly from our compulsory CPF contributions.

Investments are high risks activities and our national investments made through GIC companies are and had not been immuned to losses. There were cases of losses before and more recently the australian university debacle here and more frighteningly, the thai telco investment. An obscene amount of our money lays there and if the thais make a grab for it, we would be in deep trouble ( now you know why some folks had to resign from our national telco agency)

Such dollar losses are OUR money. Should IR, Formula one and other projects fail, ( individually, the amounts are small but when all projects are added up, the money involve is substantial ) it would be a terrible blow to the coffers of our national treasury, which has to return workers their retirement funds, coupled with a growing grey population ( it got our MM so pissed he commented while on an official visit to Turkey that our local women were not doing their national service duty by giving more births but choosed to remain single)

IR is thus a necessity and a supposedly huge money spinner to our national treasury. But it is a deal with the devil in our prim and proper spore society for it invites a high degree of sleaze. While we may never totally control the devil, we would do our utmost to limit its destructive tentacles, by allowing activities that hurts no one and crimping down hard on those that do.

I would pee in my pants should one day when i start to claim my supposedly guaranteed retirement fund and the officer there tells me that they had lost it all in investments, or should disease striked, the life support system have to be shut down because the medicare funds are not enough or had dried up.

There is a cause and effect, a newtonion reaction to an action, that is both religiously and scientifically proven for everything that happens. There is a wider picture if only one cares to look. Better to look with an analytical foresight than with regretful hindsight.

This post is meant only for discussion sake and for feedback purposes. Rational and constructive feedbacks are usually welcomed by organisations as they often use it to improve their establishments. Very much different from the irrational KPKB foul lingo whines one hears. Those with common sense will know the difference.

Cheers and thanks if you read my post.:)


.

[Ronsee]

Bros lets say if we happen to stay overnight at a hotel with any viet or prc girls,will they come up and knock the door and arrest us?

I really dont know if the police can come up to the hotel and arrest people...like i have seen that night, i didnt know why the police was raiding that hotel at geylang. It could be due to other forms of vice activities and not necessarily prostitution imo.

However for me i normally bring the girls to my own home :D so it really wont bother me.

A recent incident happened while i was overseas cheonging in Indonesia and 1of my Indon chinese male friend who was a local there was caught with ICE in possession and somehow the police got wind of it and he was arrested in a hotel room and now is in custody.

Just my 2 cents.

[SonicGear]

Agree with bro Ronsee, maybe it other form of illegal activities which makes them raid the hotel. Normally think they dont anyhow raid a hotel as i believe this will really inccur big disruption & convenience to the customers staying
there.
Just my own opinion la. :D